Mike Minor was impressive in his big league debut, striking out five and walking one while allowing three earned runs over six innings. The Astros landed two bloop hits, a double by Carlos Lee and a single by Chris Johnson that led to the first two runs, followed by a Brett Wallace roping a double down the right field line. The other run scored while Minor was in the game was unearned, due to Alex Gonzalez making an error while attempting to field a ball to throw Hunter Pence out at home.
When Minor exited the game, the Braves seemed to have at least a good shot of winning. While the Astros have a solid back end of their bullpen, so do the Braves. Kyle Farnsworth brought back memories of 2005 as recorded just one out and allowed four earned runs to score. Peter Moylan relieved Farnsworth and didn't do much better, allowing two more hits and two more runs. The final blow came on a Chris Johnson single to left that Eric Hinkse fielded. Hinske fired home to try and get Pence at the plate but it was late. McCann tried to get Carlos Lee as he advanced to third but he made an errant throw that got all the way to the wall, allowing both Lee and Johnson to score.
Offensively, Jason Heyward and Brian McCann both homered, their 12th and 16th respectively. It was Heyward's birthday, so it was nice to see him break out of his homerless streak on the same day he turned 21, making him just the fourth player in MLB history to do so. Chipper Jones added two hits and Gonzalez had an RBI double in the second. Minor nearly had an RBI single in the second inning as well, but he got thrown out at first by Pence in right field.
Overall, this was a beyond forgettable game. This was one of the worst innings the Braves have had all season. Jair Jurrjens is on the mound tonight, and hopefully he can right the Braves ship and hand the ball over to Tommy Hanson with a chance to win the series on Wednesday.
0 recs | 219 comments
As crazy as this sounds, I am kind of encouraged by this game. Heyward and Heap homered, and Chipper and Glaus hit again. Chipper has really turned it on of late, and Glaus has now hit in 3 straight games.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
I agree...
This game was just one of those games you chalk up to horrible luck. When Minor was thrown out at first from the outfield, I knew this was going to be one of those games…Then the bloops, then the errors. Train wreck…
Thus, I am not going to say anything negative about the team, as there’s really no point in a game like this.
Minor really impressed me. Even after giving up those crazy bloop RBIs and the unearned run, he kept his composure. Heck, he ended the game with a solid K. Looking forward to seeing him dominate the Dodgers.
Chipper is looking great, and that 405 foot homer by J-Hey could be a sign of things to come. I am cautiously optimistic with Troy. Until I see him get a HR or crushing drive into the gap, I won’t say he’s turning things around…Not yet.
I mentioned yesterday that we would take 2 of 3. The Astros are actually playing okay of late, so I am not too upset (assuming we take care of business the next two games).
Go Bravos!
Jman781 - August 10, 2010
I think you can say something negative in regards to the errors. 15 in 10 is not championship caliber. And especially two by Alex in clutch situations. But I will agree with the hitting. On any other night when we give our starters 4 runs, we’re sitting pretty.
thenightstallion - August 10, 2010 via mobile
Gonzo is nasty with the trick double plays, but can’t tone down the ground outs for what they are….ground outs.
Hopefully he gets out of this funk and stops trying to do so much.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
Agreed
The fact that we are hitting homers (and even with someone on base!) is definitely encouraging. Also Minor looked really good, despite what his line showed. A lot of cheap hits last night, but it happens.
Hope Glaus can actually hit a ball with some power in the next game or two. I think it would rejuvenate this team.
ryantex - August 10, 2010
Yes!
And it was nice to see Minor pitch well and keep his composure on the mound after all those frustrating bloop singles.
That inning (as horrible as it was) is not indicative of our Braves.
We’re better than that.
NCChopper - August 10, 2010
Yeah, I should hav mentioned Minor too. He seems to have pitched well.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
Great start to his big league career!
UpstateNyBravesFan - August 10, 2010
I apologize if I sound like a douche, but I have to air out a pet peeve. The past tense form of “to lead” is LED, not LEAD. This has been so rampant around here lately, and its driving me nuts.
J-Freak - August 10, 2010 via mobile
You don’t sound like a douche, just a typo.
BenDuronio - August 10, 2010
Yeah I’m definitely not singling you out or anything, just ran into a straw/camel situation, as virtually everyone has been writing it that way of late. I meant no offense to anybody, so thanks for understanding.
J-Freak - August 10, 2010 via mobile
what a douche
secondfh - August 10, 2010
Know, ewe our knot eh doosh.
Jman781 - August 10, 2010
i think you misspelled a word or two there
Swo12bv - August 10, 2010
is that french?
Sparhawk - August 10, 2010
I didn’t realize that AAA defense came with Minor to Atlanta
Bmacbandwagon - August 10, 2010
You mean rookie-league defense. That was a wretched display last night.
This makes the third game in a month that I can recall off the top of my head where a Gonzalez error has surrendered the lead on the way to a loss. I thought he was supposed to be a reliable defender? What’s the use of making flashy plays like the DP Saturday if you also have a knack for single-handedly blowing a game every week or two?
J-Freak - August 10, 2010 via mobile
we all knew that Sea Bass's defense...
was a step down from Yunel’s…
dru_jones - August 10, 2010
Hopefully if he works on D with Infante and Prado, it will sharpen his skills some.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
Actually, Wren, the PR dept. (read: DOB and Bowman), and the A-Gon apologists ‘round these parts have been trying their damnedest to convince us that A-Gon is an elite defender and not a downgrade from Yunel. All evidence to the contrary, however. In only a month He blown 3 games, so he’s good for 18 losses per Braves season at this rate. Not only is that not elite, that makes him one of the worst in the league.
J-Freak - August 10, 2010 via mobile
We don't have to apologize
For his nine XBH in 23 games. That’s just three short of Yunel’s in 75 games, and all of his were doubles.
Gonzalez has been a clear upgrade on the offensive side of the plate this season. It’s undeniable.
The defense will come around. You’re taking a guy who was playing for fourth place in the division and putting him right into the middle of a penant race, replacing an elite defender. That’s a lot of pressure, and it’s going to take some time for him to settle in.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
Yunel has been a clear upgrade to the Yunel from the first half too.
Also, when looking at the big picture and not some SSS, Gonzalez is a clear downgrade offensively.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
Yunel’s offensive output post-trade is purely circumstantial and has no merit in this particular debate. We’ve gone over this before, so I’m not going to rehash it again.
Thing is, we’re not looking at the bigger picture. We’re looking at a window of the second half of this season and possibly the next (assuming Gonzalez’s option is picked up). If we were concerned about the bigger picture, we wouldn’t have made the trade in the first place.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
We all have to remember that he came from Toronto and the ball flies in the park. That is why Yunel is now hitting the long ball. The Ted is a pitchers park. It is a hard thing to gage since you are comparing apples to oranges in the sense of power production.
FreddieFreemanTime - August 10, 2010
Not looking at the big picture is exactly the problem. We gave up an excellent piece for a guy with a long track record of mediocrity on the off-chance he’d stay on fire for another year and a half. And the one appreciable skill we were told he had, his defense, has let us down pretty badly already.
XBH didn’t stop him from blowing three games for us already. Slugging percentage be damned, there’s no way we should have moved Yunel for this guy.
J-Freak - August 10, 2010 via mobile
Which three games did he blow for us??
Certainly not last nite. No single person can blow a game that you lose by six runs.
Quit scapegoating.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
So, because he’s blown three leads that led to losses, I’m scapegoating? If he makes that routine play, he holds the lead and the out changes how their lineup turns over. At that point there’s no way of knowing if Farny would have come in, and even if he still had, anything could have happened against that different lineup that may or may not have led to that circus.
Bottom line: 3 lead-surrendering errors, all leading to losses. I don’t have to scapegoat, as he’s brought his own shame on his own head.
J-Freak - August 10, 2010 via mobile
What about Wagner?
He’s been shaky lately, too. Do you have a problem with him? Or are you confident that he will be the Wagner that he’s been for his entire career? If so, why is that different from Gonzo? Over the course of his career, he’s been a very reliable fielder. Thus, it is more likely than not, that he’ll be fine down the stretch…
Jman781 - August 10, 2010
Wagner has a track record of sheer dominance.
Gonzalez has a track record of suckiness.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
I think there needs to be more...
Stats like this.
While sabermetrics are growing on me, having stats like sheer dominance, suckiness, awesomeness, distance behind Jason Hewyard, etc. would make baseball discussions livelier and easier to follow!
Jman781 - August 10, 2010
I struggle to see how the play was routine. If all he had to do was field the ball and toss it to first, that’d be routine.
Throwing a fairly speedy runner out at home while playing in a fairly hard-hit grounder is not exactly routine. There’s a lot that can go wrong, and, unfortunately, something did. Even if he fields it cleanly, he’s got to make a quick throw home and McCann’s got to catch the throw, block the plate and apply a tag while the runner avoids it with a slide.
Even if Gonzalez and McCann do everything right, there’s still a moderate chance the run scores.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
What probably frustrates me most is that we didn’t even mortgage our future effectively. Anyone looking at A-Gon’s career could tell you he was not going to be the offensive engine of our team going forward, particularly given the distance of some of his HRs in Toronto. If we had flipped Yunel for a rental who was a really good bet to mash, I’d be ok with it. I want this season very much. But we flipped him for an aging, mediocre guy instead. That’s frustrating.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
This
J-Freak - August 10, 2010 via mobile
What future was mortgaged??
Yunel isn’t and never will be the face of a franchise.
He’s an elite defender that can hit for average and take a walk. That’s it.
He’s a nice piece, no doubt, but he’s not an elite player on the whole. His ceiling is one or two all-star years, and that’s probably pushing it.
I liked Yunel as much as the next person, but you’re making him out to be a lot more than he ever will be.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
A medium-size mortgage. But you don’t have to trade away the face of the franchise in order to screw up your future. Yunel was cost-controlled. After Gonzalez, they are probably going to have to test the free agent waters to find a new SS (unless Mycal Jones makes big strides over the next season and a half). That’s money we won’t have to improve other parts of the lineup, including our generally poor crop of up-the-middle bats.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
Team-controlled or not, Yunel is probably as or more expensive than Gonzalez next season because of arbitration. The following arbitration year, tack on more money, and so forth.
Money-wise, it’s not that big of a change at all.
Talent-wise, Gonzalez is proving to be the better bat and worse glove. There’s a trade-off there, obviously. Once Gonzalez can get settled in, his defense probably becomes a much smaller factor than it is currently.
So…do we have a guy in our system that can play SS in 2012?? Maybe. If not, we have at most one year before someone from within the organization can step in.
The fill-in may or may not make more than Yunel does in 2013…depends on how Escobar progresses with another organization and how much he’s awarded in arbitration.
For all the talks of the “future,” it’s really not that big of an issue.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
You know....
you don’t have to put “-C” every time.
We know it’s you…..
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
You know....
You don’t have to put:
every time.
We know it’s you ;-)
Jman781 - August 10, 2010
lmao
sigs are automatically added though.
you should just make “-C” your sig. ;)p
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
Habit...not just here, trust me
And I’ve found that it’s so ingrained that putting it in signature doesn’t work, you’ll just end up with a double -C at the end.
Since I’m a writer (and thus always near a keyboard) with a habit of spreading my unwanted opinion, the entire interwebs are littered with -Cs. I’ve actually been doing it since I was 9 or 10, leaving notes for my parents that I’m playing video games at neighbor Jimmy’s house.
Some find it annoying, and I can’t blame them, but it’s personally not a habit I find worth trying to break. Trust me, I’ve got enough problems as is without attempting to tackle this one.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
whatever works, i guess
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
I believe including Pastornicky in the deal...
was for the purpose of answering “SS in 2012?” Including him, especially if he become a solid player, makes the deal seem a lot less lopsided, does it not?
Mr. Sanchez - August 10, 2010
Yeah...
Plus, given how he was viewed in the clubhouse, Yunel was done as a Brave. Do people really think that we were going to keep Yunel for the next decade? Really? Yes, Yunel was “controlled” for a few years (don’t know how many more), but he wasn’t staying around here. It seemed he really didn’t want to be here either (my opinion).
I suppose people may say that he only bothered Chipper and Cox, and the new coach may have loved Yunel. I doubt that was true…
Thus, we were able to get a solid (not spectacular) SS with decent pop and a good clubhouse guy (combined with two prospects). Statistically, Gonzo is an average fielder…not spectacular, but not worthy of the lashing he is getting right now…
At the time of the trade, Escobar was mired in a horrible slump and was a slight head case…While some fantasy GMs may have been able to sell the “potential” card and received a better trade, I doubt there was a much better option out there that could help our team immediately…
Jman781 - August 10, 2010
I would have loved to see the Yunel Escobar that Fredi Gonzalez would have managed.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
Ha...
That would’ve been interesting…Why don’t we simply find a way to reunite Fredi and Hanley in Atlanta?
Jman781 - August 10, 2010
Mortgaging the future doesn’t mean selling the face of your franchise, it means creating a hole where you wouldn’t otherwise have one (which can include selling a FotF, but isn’t restricted to it), which is exactly what we did. Was Yunel a superstar? Of course not, and I don’t think anyone here is arguing that he was. Was he better than every other internal or realistic trade option? Yes. Was he a somewhat above-average offensive SS and an elite, if not THE elite defender? Hell yes. Alex Gonzalez is an indisputable downgrade that is going to sting even more when we’re stuck with him for 162 games next season.
J-Freak - August 10, 2010 via mobile
This
Braves24 - August 10, 2010 via mobile
There is a big difference between someone being the face of a franchize and someone else being a very good player.
Yunel never would have been the face of the franchize. You are correct.
However, he is a top 3 SS in the NL, and top 10 in all of baseball.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
Dammit.
Franchise.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
I assume...
You meant top 3 in the AL. National League has quite a few good SS. AL…not so much.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
That’s it. Gracias.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
Could it also be that Yunel just quit trying in Atlanta?
dunnytwogloves - August 10, 2010
Possibly, and under the circumstances, I can’t really blame him.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
what circumstances? Bobby wanting him to play hard?
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
No, teamates giving up on him, ostricizing him and fans booing him.
Not saying it wasn’t his own fault, but still. Under those circumstances, I can’t really blame him for giving up – if that is indeed what he did.
There were plenty of other players who made mistakes and had attitudes, and Bobby didn’t single them out the way he did Yunel.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
Yeah
Bobby sure singled him out! I mean, all four years that he was the starting shortstop. And I mean, come on! Bobby didn’t even give him half a season to figure things out! Oh wait….
sag969 - August 10, 2010
Some people just cannot be reasoned with. You are appearing to be one of them.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
lmao
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
Alex Gonzalez has a 0.5 WAR in 91 PA, 23 G. Yunel Escobar had a 1.1 WAR in 389 PA, 94 G with Atlanta.
BenDuronio - August 10, 2010
if you're going to cite stats like WAR
you should be smart enough not to make an argument based on 23 games
kbertling353 - August 10, 2010
.................
What circumstances?
That the Braves were in 1st place? That they were on their way to making the playoffs for the first time in five years?
I have a bad feeling that you’ll still be trolling about this trade for the rest of the season, the offseason, and (since all signs point to the fact that Gonzalez will be back next year) next season, and probably the 2011 offseason as well. Frankly, its depressing. The trade was done, please shutup.
sag969 - August 10, 2010
You know, you could just not read my comments.
And don’t tell me to shut up.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
I would love
To not read your comments. Unfortunately we don’t have a post block option.
And uhm, I already told you to shut up. And what’s with this “don’t tell me to shutup?” You’re going to grow some e-muscles and beat me up?
Please, just go troll somewhere else.
sag969 - August 10, 2010
You remind me of a guy who sent me an email this past week.
He said that he did not appreciate the fact that I debate people, and that my “attitude” was offensive to him.
His screen name was MFers – yet I was the one who was offensive.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
I like the fact that you debate people. even when I don’t agree with you. That’s what blogs are for.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
My bad man. I didn’t know I was going to start a debate with my first question.
dunnytwogloves - August 10, 2010
By sending you...
an email, I was attempting to keep by distain for your comments private. The screen name relates to my last name. I do not object to debate, however,your know it all attitude is offensive to me.While I do not agree that anyone should be told to shut up,I do agree with sag969 regarding wishing I had a iggy button.
mikie baseball - August 10, 2010
I do not have a know it all attitude.
I say “I don’t know” plenty of times.
But, I’ll tell you what I do know – what I think, and why I think it.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
It is very difficult...
for me to let your statements stand,as I committed myself to ignore them. Your comment above is exactly what I meant regarding your tone,and my desire not to engage in any exchange with you. I do not appreciate you posting my screen name.I also said you were combative in your tone and I object to that. I said nothing about not wanting debate or expressing opinions. I kept it off board. You however choose for some reason to compare me with with someone else,whom you have obviously started another of your “debates” BTW, everyone has an opinion.
mikie baseball - August 10, 2010
I had no idea that MFers was you. You let us all know that.
IIRC, there is a poster around here with that exact screen name. I assumed it was him.
And yes, everyone does have an opinion.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
I only have a few hairs...
left on my head. My points are, you did not need to recant our “private” conversation. When you did ,you erroneously stated that debate wasnt appreciated, and finally you posted my screen name to insuate that I was being offensive with it. The whole post was not required, but to show how you are the poor victim of being misquoted and not understood. My mistake was stopping to read the comment.
mikie baseball - August 10, 2010
Alright seriously
Both of you stop.
Nobody cares about your beef with one another, and a public thread is not the place to be airing out your dirty laundry.
royhobbs - August 10, 2010
which is often contrarian in nature
and yeah, you do have a bit of a know it all mentality around here (I know, Kettle/Pot, and all that, but then it does take one to know one).
Mr. Sanchez - August 10, 2010
Also, I think it is unpossible, according to E-laws to be a troll when adding input to the very long conversation at hand.
Trolling is typically what happens when someone runs into a room, yells something ridiculous and then runs out, never to be heard from again.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
Really?
Now we’re arguing about trolling.
What do you call a person who continues to cry and moan about something a month after is over? And will (more than likely) continue to do so for the next few years? Furthermore, whenever there is any opportunity to discuss this event (no matter how closely related to the actual post it is or not), that person will still somehow manage to bring it up and start arguments again.
Oh well, I really should know better than to ever reply to your posts again. I just couldn’t believe your “given the circumstances” comment. Anyways, lunch break is over. Enjoy the rest of your afternoon trolling!
sag969 - August 10, 2010
To be fair...
Justin’s not a troll.
He’s very argumentative, and I don’t always agree on his points, but he’s not out here for the sole purpose of getting folks riled up.
Very opinionated, sure, no doubt about it. Verbose as well. So am I, and some others. But we are sharing our opinions, not trying to stir up a crowd.
There are plenty of true trolls on the site, have no fear. It’s best to save the troll arguments for them.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
+1
DawgB - August 10, 2010
You would have an outstanding point – if I had brought up the trade…sadly for you, I didn’t.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
Now, now, children.
Now you’ve stopped talking about baseball altogether, and are arguing over rules of the internet. Get back on topic, please.
royhobbs - August 10, 2010
*dejected
Yes sir.
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
Busted!!!!
dunnytwogloves - August 10, 2010
I’m as frustrated with the Escobar deal as anyone, but Gonzalez is not as bad as he’s been looking out there lately. He’s a better-than-average defender, just not elite the way Yunel is.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
Even Kelly Johnson dropped a popup every now and then.
:)
justincredubil02 - August 10, 2010
It's a high-pressure play...
Bang, bang play at home, if he can field it clean and make the throw. Remember, McCann still has to apply the tag, block the slide, etc. It’s not a sure thing.
He looked up too soon and flubbed it. It happens a handful of times in every football game.
As far as errors go, it wasn’t anywhere near as horribly played as the fiasco that led to the bases-clearing single.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
Phillies will overtake us within the week with us playing games like this.
taney71 - August 10, 2010
I see the Phils losing 3 out of their 5 next games. I don’t see them staying as hot as they’ve been.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
but at the same time….they should be fully healthy in Sept we need to have a healthy lead at the end of august…4 games would be pretty solid, more would be better… Despite how the Phils have played this year in certain spots…they are still a very good team and if we don’t play well they will take over the division….but at the end of the day we are in first and thus its in our hands…keep winning and we win the division…pretty easy
Swo12bv - August 10, 2010
Those last 6 games vs the Phils are going to be fun. I still predict we win the division.
But, absolute worse-case scenario, Wild Card.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
we HAVE to win the division
the wild card race is just too close at this point to chance it.
toppleprone - August 10, 2010
Thank you..
for the cogent analysis.
sddbaker - August 10, 2010
is that you fizzbot?
Kobe:The Legend - August 10, 2010
Can’t believe we got Farnsworth back, he just plain sucks. Hopefully he doesn’t pitch anymore an we can win the next two…
wisco - August 10, 2010
I was thinking after we aquired him, “Didn’t we bash him when he pitched against us with the Royals this year?”
thenightstallion - August 10, 2010 via mobile
Farnsworth is the right-handed Jo-Jo Reyes
I saw that El Duque is looking to get back into the big leagues. He couldn’t be any worse. KK would have been a better option than Farnsworth, and he’s in the minors.
John Holton - August 10, 2010
I must be confused, because I thought that I heard that Alex Gonzalez was a great defensive player?
He has now had 3 HUGE errors in the last week and a half. I also thought he had post-season experience, which usually means that a guy does not choke when the pressure is on, yet, in tight situations, he seems unable to make routine plays.
I wish that there were some interleague games left so that B-Mac could DH. His defense has been an abomination for the last few weeks. Yes, Hanson is slow to the plate, but still, some of the runners who have stolen on him would have been out with even a decent throw, which, Mac cannot seem to come up with right now.
Pundits always talk about how the heat always withers the Texas Rangers every season, but I am beginning to wonder if it is taking a toll on the Braves this year. It has been oppressively hot since June, and some of the guys, particularly B-Mac, simply look gassed.
Fred Pen - August 10, 2010
Bad Luck Come in Threes
So, maybe A-Gonz is just getting it all out of his system at once.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
B-Mac hasn't been terrible. I mean, he has thrown out several runners and I don't know that he's had a horrific PB rate.
iamthesgt - August 10, 2010
It has not just been his throws to second...he has had a couple of balls that went into left field
and he has had some terrible passed balls/wild pitches. Remember the one that hit him right in the glove a couple of weeks ago? I think he needs a couple of days’ rest.
Fred Pen - August 10, 2010
McCann seems to have some issues with throwing the ball to second this year. I agree, they all seem to be sailing.
Sparhawk - August 10, 2010
Alex atoned for 2 of them.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
It doesn’t count as atonement when the game-blowing error comes AFTER the homer.
J-Freak - August 10, 2010 via mobile
Fair enough. Our D has been slipping a little, however, on the bright side, we’ve still won our last 3 series (Reds, Mets, Giants)
Could have been alot worse.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
we won the series against the reds?
i thought we lost it…i’m just having problems remembering bc i tried to block out that whole time period with the melky throw to heyward haha
forgotten_glory - August 10, 2010
It's okay...
that confusion thing hits all of us sooner or later.
sddbaker - August 10, 2010
When you lose by six runs...
No single error is HUGE.
It’s an error. It cost us a run, at worst. It certainly didn’t cost us the game.
They scored six more runs after that in another inning.
Let’s not make too much of it.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
a bigger error in a sense
was his mental error that changed the flow of that inning entirely
forgotten_glory - August 10, 2010
Well, the next two batters struck out, so I’m guessing the space-time continuum wasn’t horribly damaged by his error.
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
He is, Bobby reminds us of it after every error.
10-4 - August 10, 2010
Minor was luckless
he was robbed in his 1st at bat (F$%#ng Pence). would had been a RBI single in his 1st at bat in the 1st pitch. (a awesome achievement for a pitcher)
2 blooper hits cost him 3 runs
he only gave up one walk, but that walk scored with the help of bad defense.
joshant - August 10, 2010
He had luck, it was just bad luck.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
also that hit would had been his 1st hit as a professional because
he never had one in the minor league.
(0-18) 11 K 2SH
joshant - August 10, 2010
To be fair, the Astros had some really hard hit balls in the first inning that went deep to Ankiel, almost against the wall to Hinske, and then a liner right at Infante.
BenDuronio - August 10, 2010
Minor's the Man
As I predicted yesterday, 6 innings pitched, 3 earned runs, 1 rough inning. So much for the nay-sayers and draft pundits.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
Minor Rocked It........Farnsworth sucks. We have better options within.....Kimbrell
I got pretty comfortable with Glaus’ solid D at 1st in the first half of the season, but now I get nervous any time the other team has a guy on first. It seems like the ball gets by Troy fairly often, over there. Not trying to place any blame anywhere, and I hope he keeps riding his “3 game hit streak,” but it’s apparent to me that Glaus is Bobby’s last “Norton,” and for better or worse, I think he’ll be sticking with him through the final run.
When Prado comes back, I think Prad at 1st and Infante at 2nd would be really solid. I think it would plug up some leaky, creaky knees over there.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
Main difference...
is that Glaus is a much better player than Norton ever was.
sddbaker - August 10, 2010
I would still rather have Prad at 1st, Infante at 2nd……let Troy spend all his time on hitting. Get that back. He could be huge off the bench in the latter innings of a game.
Risky as that may be, that’s what I would do.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
AAAHHHHHH GREG NORTON!!!!
AHHHHHH!!!!
SuperNewb - August 10, 2010
Minor, Hanson, JJ(as a brave), Medlen debut
JJ against Pirates at home (April 2, 2008). Braves won 10-2. JJ got the win
5.1 IP 7H 2R 2ER 1BB 5SO
Medlen against Rockies at home (May 21, 2009). Medlen got the lose. Braves lost (0-9)
3 IP 3H 5R 5ER 5BB 3SO
Hanson against Brewers at home (June 7, 2009). Hanson got a ND. Braves won (8-7)
6 IP 6H 7R 6ER 1BB 5SO 3HR
Minor against Astros at away (August 9, 2010) Minor got a ND. Braves lost (10-6)
6IP 5H 4R 3ER 1BB 5SO
joshant - August 10, 2010
JJ debut in MLB as Tiger
Against Indians (August 15, 2007). JJ got the lose. Tigers lost 2-5
7IP 5H 4R 4ER 2BB 3SO 1HR
joshant - August 10, 2010
Still, not a bad ML debut.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
……We lost 10-6?
Either way, I couldn’t take anymore and turned it off.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
sorry, we lost 10-4 in Minor debut
joshant - August 10, 2010
Minor’s debut matches up well. It’s on par with JJ’s.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
blooper
correct me if im wrong but i think bloop hits still get counted as hits in the stats. doesnt matter if a bloop hit or a HR contributed to the loss. the only thing that happened last night was that the Braves got DUSTED-BIG TIME. stop making excuses. when you get to the playoffs every team has good pitching. B
llabyug - August 10, 2010 via mobile
granted, but that many strategically placed bloops is unreal.
I agree that it can only go up from here.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
Bloop hits are usually a sign of not getting good wood on the ball, i.e.: being off balance or trying to adjust to late movement on a pitch. While the are still counted as hits, they are a lot easier to work around than a home run.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
Actually...
they now only count as .5 hit each. Try to keep up.
sddbaker - August 10, 2010
+100
SuperNewb - August 10, 2010
So, Minor’s WHIP is really .5833333? Way cool.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
It’s not really an excuse if it’s factual information.
BenDuronio - August 10, 2010
As CAC put it...
This is why we have BABIP. If you think the Astros’ success on bloop hits last night is repeatable, then I have a stake in a certain execrable baseball franchise down Texas way you might be interested in.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
I havent
maizebaseball10 - August 10, 2010 via mobile
Sorry iPhone glitch. I haven’t seen anyone mention starting Omar Infante in Left? I’d call up FF for 1st, stick Omar in LF against eighties, Diaz against lefties. Vice versa for ankle and melky in CF. I’d take Glaus at first over Hinske though. Don’t get me wrong I love the guy but besides defensively Hinskes been just as bad as Glaus
maizebaseball10 - August 10, 2010 via mobile
The weird thing is that Hinske and Glaus were like offensive machines in the 1st half, and then they both seemed to fall off the wagon. …..Too much time spent with TP? lol
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
I would wait on calling up Freeman until September. He is just now getting in a groove, after a slow start. He needs the AB’s. If he’s called up now, he will most likely be platooning or riding the pine. Platooning Hinske and Glaus makes the most sense right now. Getting Troy some rest will proably help him.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
That.
taking Melky out of the line-up is ridiculous (the bad kind). He has been an offensive force, compared to others. And, despite one or two dumbass plays, has been pretty good in the OF.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
Everyone is entitled to a dumbass play now and again. It just seems that ours have been coming in bunches lately. Let’s get them out of the way now.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
We need Melky’s bat. We don’t need Troy’s.
….Never thought I would say that….
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
We need Troy's bat....
We just have ot been getting much of it lately
DawgB - August 10, 2010
Do you honestly think Troy will be raking this month?
(no sarcasm, just wondering what you think)
I mean, I hope he does, but he still looks lost up there, and I don’t think TP gives a hoot about making adustments.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
He could. He’s a streaky hitter with an established record of hitting success at the major-league level. I don’t think a few months around the much-maligned Terry Pendleton has changed that. Nor do I think Troy has simply gone to pieces all of a sudden.
Still, for the time being a platoon sounds reasonable to me. Troy is just clearly not getting it done, and with the Phillies breathing down our necks we need to put him on a path to playing in top form again. Some extra time on the bench might just do that.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
He seems about as quick on his feet as Bobby.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
If he gets some rest, think he will be a lot more productive. I don’t think he will get his May numbers, but we should see improvement.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
Both of them may still revert to career form
In which case it will be Melky on the bench, with Troy a key part of the offense once again.
But yeah, this slump has been brutal for him.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
This game was ugly, but I’m confident the Braves will win the series.
TonyAlmeyda - August 10, 2010
Miss you, Yunel
But I’m so glad we got the professional, sure-handed, very serious Alex Gonzalez in your place.
Obviously SSS, but perhaps now people can cut out claiming that Yunel was actually a bad defender because his “mental errors” somehow negated his amazing range and arm.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
yeah, despite Yunel’s occasional “mental errors” he probably saved 1-2 runs a game.
But I think the worst is behind Gonzo. He knows that he’s made a few mistakes, but let’s move on and keep up the good work.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
I don't really blame Gonzalez
Everyone makes errors. I was just taking the opportunity to vent some frustration with the idiots who denigrated the defense of the best SS in the league.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
A-Gonz is very solid defensively. Just running through a rough patch right now. Let’s see where they both are at the end of the season.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
They have both been very similar in terms of inconsistency defensively. I haven’t seen much of a difference on that side of the ball. Offensively, I sure have, in favor of Gonzalez.
BenDuronio - August 10, 2010
Defensively, at shortstop…..
Yunel was 8-9.
So far (including errors) Gonzo has been a 6-7. If he keeps hitting, and tightens that up, that works.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
They both made some amazing plays and both made some downright awful plays.
BenDuronio - August 10, 2010
Gonzo has already made about as many “downright awful plays” as Yunel would make in a span of maybe 3 months. Just saying.
Not knocking Gonzo. I like what I see. Just tighten it up.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
I remember Yunel making some awful plays against the Nationals in one game, the Strasburg vs. Hudson start, I believe. It was pretty sad.
BenDuronio - August 10, 2010
We all have bad games every now and then. Even the best of us.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
All the objective measurements of defensive performance are in agreement that Yunel is an elite defensive SS, and that Gonzalez is good but not great. So people who wanted to knock Yunel’s defense have resorted to attacking his mental errors or consistency or some other such gibberish. And now Gonzalez is showing that he, too, has mental errors and isn’t consistent, just like every other human being playing the game of baseball. My point is, if you throw Yunel under the bus for allegedly lollypopping a throw to Glaus, you should be throwing Gonzalez under the bus for dropping a routine grounder.
But you shouldn’t really be throwing either of them under the bus; you should just be acknowledging that Yunel is the superior defender, and justifying the trade with reference to their respective offensive performances. There’s a reasonable argument to be made there, although I still don’t think it makes up for the tradeoff in long-term value.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
Definitely solid. Definitely above-average. Definitely NOT as good as Yunel, who is phenomenal out there.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
If only he could have come out from underneath his constant rain cloud.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
The risk taken in the trade was that of getting a better bat in exchange for not as good a fielder. Wren must have thought that A-Gonz would help more with the bat than taking Escobar out of the filed would hurt.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
As long as he keeps hitting, and works on D with Infante and Prado (the Venezuela crew) I think his defensive play will get tighter.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
He’s not horrible to start with. He’s a fine shortstop, although perhaps not an elite fielder. Certainly working with Omar and Marteeeen couldn’t hurt.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
Hopefully they all get to watch THE SANDLOT on a flight. I could see that re-lighting the flame.
“Eye on the ball, Scotty. The key to this game……. If the ball moves…move your glove. Got it?”
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
What do you guys think of Fernando Martinez?
I think his approach is a little lacking.
TheLetter2 - August 10, 2010
I’m getting a kick out of talking to myself.
TheLetter2 - August 10, 2010
Wait, you too? I love doing that!
TheLetter2 - August 10, 2010
Now you're just being a douchebag. Leave these nice people alone.
TheLetter2 - August 10, 2010
You know what? Fuck you!
TheLetter2 - August 10, 2010
BANNED
TheLetter2 - August 10, 2010
C-C-C-C-C-Combo Breaker!!
-C
cthabeerman - August 10, 2010
CANNED
-C
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
I for one
think the two most important things about yesterday are Minor, and the way Chipper is swinging the bat recently. I love reading how Chipper said he has had a new approach mentally. It goes something like…I could care less each time I go to the plate. He is taking the pressure of being Chipper off his shoulders,and is now taking some serious rips at the ball. For me that is more important than the Glaus, Melky, Gonzo discussions, because they are not going to lead this team to a Championship, whereas Chipper can. The other is Minor, and i am not sure what to make of last night.
mikie baseball - August 10, 2010
I think you can make of it that he pitched well against a really bad lineup. Perhaps even a little better than reasonably have been expected. That’s encouraging, although obviously it’s a small sample size. What it did demonstrate is that he’s “ready” for MLB in some sense—his control is solid, and he doesn’t go to pieces when runners get on. (Speaking of which—quite apart from all the other bad Farnsworth stuff going on last night, what the fuck was up with those six pickoff attempts which ultimately resulted in an error and an advance? Focus on the guy at the plate, Farns.)
SS451 - August 10, 2010
Focusing on the really...
bad lineup remark. While I agree, right now they are dangerous. They are, Pittsburgh is,as well as the Nats. Zero expectations for these clubs.In a way, much akin to Chipper’s approach at the plate these days.
mikie baseball - August 10, 2010
I make the following
We have another soilid starter. He got his debut and any possible nervousness out of the way. He gave us a chance to win. Perhaps that is more importan than blowing the game later. I heard once thatin a given season, a team will win 54 games(’62 Mets excluded) and lose 54 games, no matter what. Perhaps this was one of those 54 games.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
FFstats in AAA
(International League)
AVG .306 (3rd)
OBP. 368 (9th)
SLG. .508 (4th)
OPS. .876 (3rd)
Hits 115 (T-4th)
Doubles 27 (T-3rd)
HR 15 (T-15th)
RBI 71 (3rd)
R 56 (15th)
joshant - August 10, 2010
I would give him another month, pay Glaus his incentives out of respect for his first half, and call the F-Bomb up in Sept.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
Agreed
Let him get his AB’s in
DawgB - August 10, 2010
Wren's no spring chicken....
Hopefully, this is what he’s thinking.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
Yup.
Let FF come up in September, when there will be less pressure on him to perform, as he will not be replacing someone on the roster. He can be used to spell Glaus down the stretch.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
I swear about 100 users have registered at TC in the last month...
Just to complain about Glaus, the Escobar trade, and talk about how the Phillies are awesome… and I really wish they’d shut the f*** up.
SuperNewb - August 10, 2010
This type of acknowledgement is exactly what 95 of them are going for.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
NOOOOOOO!!!!!!
damn i suck
SuperNewb - August 10, 2010
It doesn't make much sense to group those three together.
The people most loudly calling for drastic action on Escobar a month or so ago are the same people slamming Glaus and quaking in their boots at the Phillies’ recent hot streak. None of them get small sample sizes or appreciate the influence of random chance in the game. So people who criticize the Escobar trade (like me) are probably less likely to be demanding that Troy be DFAed or declaring that the Braves’ season is over just because the Phillies have now closed the gap.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
See you say that...
but then you realize the link between the three: negative attitudes… and start to realize they are all the same people, because like you said… “None of them get small sample sizes or appreciate the influence of random chance in the game.”
SuperNewb - August 10, 2010
There are probably some people who are just pessimists who slam everything the Braves do and predict disaster around every corner. My impression is that most of the people down on the Escobar deal don’t fit that bill. Speaking for myself, I thought (and still think) it was a terrible trade (basically an overreaction to much less than one full season’s offensive performance), but I’m still relatively optimistic about the Braves’ chances of reaching the postseason and think Glaus is going to come around.
SS451 - August 10, 2010
To make us all feel better, please enjoy this video of Justin Bieber running into a glass door: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhOaJmoLXks
MBL1 - August 10, 2010
lmao
I love you. Just so you know.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
+1000
there’s also a good one of him getting hit in the face with a water bottle somewhere
SuperNewb - August 10, 2010
The water bottle incident:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0GjKiy3nSI
kidnarcolepsy - August 10, 2010
HaHAHAHA
MBL1 - August 10, 2010
lmao
love you, too
Didn’t really look like a water bottle. more like a purse or something.
I’m glad I’m too old to give a crap about that little kid.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
i saw that...
whoever threw that has got an arm…
forgotten_glory - August 10, 2010
Put him in the OF
MBL1 - August 10, 2010 via mobile
The 15 - 20 people who were still around at the end of the open thread last night...
Were awesome.
SuperNewb - August 10, 2010
I know I’m awesome
MBL1 - August 10, 2010
Blame him
bravesforever16 - August 10, 2010
I played MarioKart today!
MBL1 - August 10, 2010
I'm playing it right now hahaha
bravesforever16 - August 10, 2010
it rules
MBL1 - August 10, 2010
I played it on SuperNES yesterday : )
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
I'm playing on the Wii
bravesforever16 - August 10, 2010
lol. I figured.
Get it while you can. Summer’s almost over.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
Yeah and I haven't finished my summer assignments either
bravesforever16 - August 10, 2010
Bummer
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
havent even started mine
Braves24 - August 10, 2010 via mobile
Height tags
Or smaller images.
Informal warning.
royhobbs - August 10, 2010
Minor certainly looked as if he belonged, even if the results weren’t quite there. It’s easy to blame the runs on bloop hits, but the funny thing is that a lot of balls were hit hard off of him, too—it’s just that many of them went foul or were caught. I think he can definitely pitch up here, but it’s going to be a process. He’s going to be inconsistent (like a rookie, go figure).
As for the rest of the game… Well, I like that Jason hit a homer. The rest I’m going to forget about.
Jacob Peterson - August 10, 2010
I was impressed with Minor. Fastball was right at 92, but got it up to 95 for a K.
He didn’t seem to have an out pitch despite the 5ks. Players were fighting off that change every time. I didn’t really see too many curveballs (thoughI wasn’t watching the whole time) and his fastball didn’t seem to have any movement.
I wonder if he should keep his slider and use it against lefties. He was a victim of chance bloop hits, but he looked very good out there. That was just the crappiest luck I’ve seen in awhile.
Sparhawk - August 10, 2010
His results were there. 4 runs (3 earned) and we were in a tie when he came out. He only allowed 5 hits (bloops or not) in 6 innings, with 1 walk and 5 K’s.
DawgB - August 10, 2010
Minor pitched good. Heyward and Mac homered. Chipper continues to rake like I said he would and Troy gets another hit. We won right? Wrong. The defense was horrible and killed us. We have to improve on defense or the good pitching we have won’t do us any good.
Braves24 - August 10, 2010 via mobile
I commented on this in the GT last night / Throwovers to 1st base...
If you’re just trying to keep the runner close and have no real intention of trying to pick him off...
WHY even throw the ball? If the pitcher stops and takes a hard look to 1st, the runner WILL go back.
Every time a throwing error is made and it’s on an obvious attempt to just hold the runner, I just shake my head.
One can accomplish the same result without the risk of a missed catch.
That is all… :-)
NCChopper - August 10, 2010
That’s one way to look at it. But keeping him close goes a long way.
If it’s thrown over there, which it always will be, and is catchable, it should be caught, and is caught, by most at 1st.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - August 10, 2010
I agree...
and I think that Troy should have gotten to that ball. It’s his mobility that worries me more than anything.
jbeachbum24 - August 10, 2010
Exactly
Most of his problems, in the field and in the batter’s box, are keyed by his shaky legs. I don’t want to DFA him, I want to DL him. Big difference.
Sam Jethroe - August 10, 2010
Anyone else notice
how hard Farnsworth throws intentional walk pitches? 86mph! I wonder if that’s just because he’s trying to stay loose or what, but damn.
Xshare - August 10, 2010
He's a doofus
Almost every question about Farnsworth can be answered by that salient fact.
Sam Jethroe - August 10, 2010
a doofus
that could kick your ass, he’s a black belt in krav maga, i’d imagine he’s the kind of guy who gets fired up for just about anything, including intentional walks lol
CoxXx - August 10, 2010
Fun thread.
Scott Coleman - August 10, 2010
So....
J-Hey hit his 12th homer on his 21st birthday….eerie aye?
ROBravo - August 10, 2010
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