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Talking Chop

Postcards from the Edge: Updates on Some Former Braves

We Braves fans tend to get attached to our players, so I think it's a good idea to periodically check in on a few of our former players to see how they are doing with their new teams. Here are some updates on 5 former Braves:

Jeff Francoeur, Mets

Frenchy (as you probably heard) got off to an unfathomably good start. At one point, he was leading the league in on-base percentage. Yes, Hell froze over--but don't worry, it's thawed out nicely since then; I don't think  Hitler will need a parka for too much longer. Jeff is mired in an 0-for-22 slump right now and has resumed his free-swinging ways. According to our colleagues at Amazin' Avenue, he saw 8 pitches in his 4 at-bats last night. Now that's the Jeff Francoeur that we know and are highly ambivalent toward. Despite the slump, though, his overall numbers are quite good:

AVG OBP SLG HR BB% K% WAR
.281 .358 .526 3 11.9% 10.5% 0.5

His peripherals actually support this level of performance. He has more walks than strikeouts, and his BABIP is only .260 (his career mark is .303), so he hasn't been getting a lot of lucky hits. Perhaps the most striking (get it?) stat is that so far, he has swung at "only" 52% of the pitches he's seen, which is 4% lower than in any other year and 6.5% lower than his career mark. He's also been missing less often--his contact rate of 83% would be the highest of his career. If he can keep this up (a gigantic, Heyward-sized if), he might actually develop into the player many of us thought he could be.

(Updates on Acosta, KJ, LaRoche, and Javy Vazquez after the jump...)

Star-divide

Manny Acosta, Mets

Acosta made his Mets debut last night, and it went exactly as we Braves fans would have expected. He struck out the side in the 6th inning but imploded in the 7th, giving up 3 runs, including a 2-run Alfonso Soriano HR. The Mets were only trailing 3-1 when he came in but would go on to lose 9-3. His final line: 1.1 IP, 3 ER, 2 H, 2 BB, 3 K, 1 HR.

It feels good to see that line and know that it came for the Mets, not the Braves, doesn't it?

Kelly Johnson, Diamondbacks

Kelly is another former Baby Brave who has started the year on a tear. He hasn't hit a homer in 10 games, but he has hit 4 doubles the past two nights and is now second in the majors with 8 two-baggers (Jayson Werth has 9). We all know that he'll cool down eventually, but it is great to see him thriving for his new team. I always liked Kelly a lot despite his streakiness. Here are his overall numbers for 2010:

AVG OBP SLG HR BB% K% WAR
.313 .421 .667 3 15.8% 18.8% 0.8

By the way, both Johnson and Francoeur have already topped their WAR values from 2009 (Frenchy was worth 0.4 wins and KJ was worth 0.7). There's nothing like a hot streak to erase memories of a lost season.

Adam LaRoche, Diamondbacks

LaRoche is not off to quite as hot a start as his former-and-current teammate (understatement alert!). That is not surprising at all, though; as any die-hard Braves fan knows, LaRoche does not really start hitting until July. Here are his numbers so far:

AVG OBP SLG HR BB% K% WAR
.279 .367 .372 0 12.2% 27.9% 0.1

Adam's batting average and on-base percentage are actually above his overall career averages. He just hasn't hit for any power yet. He has only 4 extra-base hits, all of them doubles. Don't worry about Roachy, though. He'll be fine once it warms up and blood starts flowing to his extremities again. For some perspective, his career slash line in April is .205 / .297 / .370. So this has actually been a fantastic April by his standards.

Javier Vazquez, Yankees

Javy's slow start in his second stint as a Yankee has been well documented. He has, however, gotten a bit better each time out. Of course, that "improvement" has been from abysmal to awful to merely sub-par. He even managed to pick up a win in his last outing despite giving up 2 homers in 5.1 IP. Here is his line so far:

W-L IP ERA H/9 K/9 BB/9 HR/9 WAR
1-2 16.1 8.27 11.02 8.27 4.41 2.20 -0.1

As you can see, Javy's strikeout rate is fine, but everything else has gone downhill. The home runs are not much of a surprise given the park he is playing in, but the large number of hits and walks are. His career H/9 is 8.88 and his career BB/9 is 2.36. That means he is allowing more than 4 extra baserunners per 9 innings relative to his career rates. Javy is too good for that to keep up for much longer.

Javy does have the "small sample size" defense on his side, which is persuasive to me, but probably not so persuasive to rabid Yankees fans (I think some of them literally have rabies... though at least they haven't projectile vomited on any little girls lately). I'd hate to see what might happen to Javy if he doesn't turn his performance around fairly soon. He's an excellent pitcher and a good teammate; I'm just not sure if New York is the right city for him. Maybe the Yankees will trade him to a quieter town (like, say, Seattle--they could use another starter). At any rate, I'll be rooting for him.

I'm thinking of making this a semi-regular post, so if you have any other former Brave that you'd like to be updated on throughout the year, leave his name in a comment. I can look up minor leaguers, too.

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Comments

and the Royals are currently 6-9…

Ah

I see what you did there

Wouldn’t mind seeing Andruw added to the list…thanks for the post

He’s been crushing the ball. YAY!

Alright,

I’ll keep tabs on him. I’ve also got Rafael Soriano on the list for next time.

And Mike Gonzalez….

Gonzo is on the DL...

and had some pretty rough outings before he went down.

Kinda makes you wonder....

Did Gonzo suffer the same injury as Jo-Jo?

Nah. Gonzo is obviously hurt from something. His velocity is way down. They did some sort of MRI on his shoulder, but I haven’t heard anything from it.

“The MRI showed no new injuries,” said Orioles manager Dave Trembley, who confirmed that Jim Johnson will get most of the save opportunities in Gonzalez’s absence. "There is some wear and tear. The injury is being classified as a shoulder strain, so he’s going to Florida to rehab.
Javy

In an ideal world, the Braves resign him to a team-friendly three-year deal during the offseason, regardless of how this season plays out for him.

Ship DLowe and KK to any team that will take them, and sign Oswalt to a three year deal as well (Roy has gone on record numerous times and stated the only teams he WANTS to play for are the Braves, Cards, and Astros – as the Astros have limited payroll and the Cards have too much invested in Albert and Holliday, the Braves have a chance if they can drop DLowe’s salary).

I'd be fine

with adding Javy after the season, provided we can get rid of Lowe’s contract without paying too much of it. Don’t really want Oswalt, though, unless another hole opens up in the rotation. He’s going to cost more than he’s likely to be worth at this stage in his career.

wait

Oswalt? why?

and ship out KK? He’s been great for us

“at this stage in his career”?

For the record, he’s younger than Javy. And DLowe’s 2011 salary > Oswalt’s potential 2011 salary. And Kawakami’s 2011 salary = Javy’s potential 2011 salary.

Why Oswalt?

Oswalt + Javy > DLowe + KK

I’d prefer Roy Oswalt, Tommy Hanson, Jair Jurrjens, Tim Hudson, and Javier Vazquez over Derek Lowe, Jair Jurrjens, Tommy Hanson, Tim Hudson, and Kenshin Kawakami any day.

And you think Wren wouldn't prefer that too?...

it’s not exactly within the realm of possibilities (at least not without likely sacrificing a bunch of talent to get other teams to agree).

Oswalt

is not as good as he used to be, but unless he give us a huge discount, he’s going to cost $15M or so a season. He’s not likely to be worth that at his age. Just ask Derek Lowe.

Seriously.

I love how people bash the Lowe signing so much, but then come right back and want to sign other aging veterans.

I'd like to think we don't sign a free agent starter for a while...

with Minor, Ortegano, and the rest of the kids coming up when KK expires after next year, Lowe and Huddy the year after that, and our other two starters being relatively young. Ideally, we don’t need to go outside the organization for a starting pitcher until 2020 or beyond.

Um, we kind of tried that already...
Ship DLowe and KK to any team that will take them

Not with KK, but at least with Lowe, no one would take him. So unless Lowe starts pitching a lot better, this ain’t happening. I hope this isn’t a sign we need to get a rosterbation thread going so this type of mess doesn’t keep spreading around in public.

With one less year of obligation for Lowe, it might be a little more appealing. The Mariners, Rangers, Mets, Nationals, Brewers, Dodgers, Diamondbacks, Orioles, and Tigers could all use a starter and could possibly have interest.

Don’t worry about rosterbation – this is potential trade deadline issues, that are always relevant now ;)

Andruw is playing well too. He lost a shit ton of weight in the offseason. 1.076 OPS. 4 HRs. Hopefully this is the year he bounces back.

Thanks for this.

I was honestly about to check on all the former Braves and just saw this. Must be my lucky day!

You obviously so my comment in the recap thread from last night’s game…jerk.

If I did

I don’t remember it now. What did you say?

Just quoted what I read on AA: link

Don't forget guys

FYF and Andruw > Heyward

Hopefully we’ll see Jo-Jo Reyes on a list of “former Braves” soon.
Thanks for those stats. Glad we got rid of Acosta. And Javy’s ERA? YIKES!

Its 3 starts that have skewed the numbers

how about

Casey Kotchman

Ooh

Good one. I’m very interested to see how he does this year.

Mariners seem to be very high on him

He’s hitting 3rd for them last time i checked.

Elvis Andrus, Neftali Feliz, Matt Harrison, and Salty?

in the minors, you’ve got options like Tyler Flowers, Gorkys Hernandez, and Edgar Osuna.

Neftali Feliz

When and why did we give him up?!

For Mark Teixiera....

as for why we made that move, it’s a touchy subject around these parts.

It’s easy why we made the move…we were trying to win.

The thing that gets touchy about it is how much faith people had in the team to do so +Tex. Alot of the people who originally loved the move now act like they hated it from the beginning. Now I know you’ve already started you weren’t in that camp, so there’s really no reason to get into a discussion about.

Agreed. Battle lines have been drawn, and none of us are leaving our foxholes.
Except on Christmas

when you will enjoy a game of soccer in No Man’s Land.

I’m willing to bet that during the original Tex trade you didn’t even know who Feliz was.

I'll be honest...

at the time, all I knew was teenager with 100mph gas. We just had one in Capellan that wasn’t much to part ways with (although we can certainly wish we’d received a better return than Fat Fuck Kolb), so it’s not like I saw Feliz becoming what he currently is. In the entire package, I was probably most fond of Andrus and Harrison. But as we both say above, the entire scenario has been hashed out time and again ad naseum, so no need to refresh memories on opinions of others.

I appreciate the fact that you’ll admit you viewed him as a question mark (as he should have been viewed). That’s what bothers me the most, the people who act like they knew he’d be a phenom from the beginning.

Some credit should go to the Rangers as well, for the way they handled (ie. didn’t screw up) Feliz and Andrus.

Unless they are psychics, they're liars...

it’d be like saying which of Robinson Lopez, Julio Teheran, and Arodys Vizcaino will pan out (among the plethora of pitchers we have down low, no disrespect to Carlos Perez, Zeke Spruill, etc). Teenager with electric stuff means possibly what Feliz is now, but no guarantee (see Cappellan, Ascaino, etc). And damn it, I was hoping we wouldn’t get this far into it, but as I’ve said all along, my beef with that deal was never any single player, more the entire package including arguably our two top position prospects and two top pitching prospects for a player that isn’t enough to push us into World Series territory.

it’d be like saying which of Robinson Lopez, Julio Teheran, and Arodys Vizcaino will pan out (among the plethora of pitchers we have down low, no disrespect to Carlos Perez, Zeke Spruill, etc). Teenager with electric stuff means possibly what Feliz is now, but no guarantee (see Cappellan, Ascaino, etc).

Agree 100%

Sometimes

I find it fascinating how emotional people get behind minor league players, and I can’t really figure out why. I agree with what you and Beard are saying, but it doesn’t change the fact that about a billion people bent out of shape after the trade, and I just can’t help but wonder why it is. Sure, all those guys could have contributed to success, but unlike most really, really bad trades, the Braves are pretty much fine and the minors still stocked just a piddly three years later, and there was no definitive way to guess that they really would pan out. I assume similarly, that if the chips don’t pan out, then the Teix trade is genius, but because Salty, Andrus and Feliz are seeing ML time these days, it’s the worst trade in history.

One of the more plausible reasons I can think for some peoples’ attachment to minor leaguers is a very simple one – bragging rights. So many guys like to be able to “call” that a player will make it one of these days, that trading them gives them reason to balk, since they won’t have the chance to make “it” with the Braves. But it doesn’t change the fact that they can tell all their peers I told you so, if they were to make it elsewhere. Kind of like how the few minority to actually had a clue that Feliz would develop, and the slightly larger minority that knew Andrus had a good shot too.

We keep leaving out Harrison...

and imo, he’s been as good if not better than Salty in that deal. Salty has been average at best, and probably a below average considering there isn’t even a hot stretch to give hope. Harrison on the other hand has had some bad moments, but had some good runs too, and his first two starts this year were solid ones before a bad outing last night in Boston, plus he doesn’t turn 25 until the end of the season. Now 20/20 hindsight shows Andrus and Feliz were the two big timers in that deal, and would be nice at say 2B and in the 8th inning, with Matt Harrison as 5th starter, eliminating the need to sign KK and Saito (or others).

That said, I can agree with pretty much all you just said. The comparison I’d make with that deal though would be with say the Padres and Peavy last year. At some point when they keep asking for top prospects, just hang up the phone and move on. But as you say, que cera cera, and what will be seems pretty nice right now so no use trying to undo what’s already be done.

And Feliz wasn’t even on those guys level (maybe Lopez, but not Teheran and Vizcaino)…

I never expected him to develop into a top 10 prospect, but I was pissed when we learned that he was the “throw in A pitcher” of the deal. Coming from my iffy memory, I believe the deal was first reported as Harrison, Salty, Andrus, and Beau Jones. I thought that was a big haul in the first place. I still support the trade though (just like the Drew-Wainwright deal)..

CB or anyone else, is that true on Feliz?...

I wasn’t closely following prospects at the time like I tend to now, but I was always under the impression Feliz and Harrison were 2 of our top 5 pitching prospects at the time of the deal, and I’d think he’d be similar to those 3, or Randall Delgado, among others. Each would have their own postives and negatives, but I’d assume those 4 would be about similar as prospects to Feliz at the time of the deal.

Well you can check Atlanta’s prospect rankings before the deal, Feliz never appeared on any top ten lists from what I remember. Delgado was a similar comparison maybe 2 seasons ago, but I’d still probably give the edge to Delgado at that age…

This was the team’s attitude after the trade: We’ve got a World Series team," shortstop Edgar Renteria said. “That makes the whole lineup more dangerous. It’s exciting.”

Afterthought...

I wonder how much the inclusion of Ron Mahay enhanced the overall package. If he’s not included, do we keep 1 or 2 of the 5 (hopefully holding on to someone other than Beau Jones obviously)?

He was having a very good season with Texas at the time, so I’m sure it played a pretty big role. Also, Beau Jones was a thought more of as a prospect than Feliz at this point, although he always had control issues..

Since you mentioned him...

Former Braves fireballer Jose Capellan is having a forgettable start with the Hanwha Eagles of the KBO. He’s 0-4 and a local commentator had this to say, “Jose Capellan’s 2-inning, 6-walk, 9-runs allowed performance might be enough to get him sent home.”

Lets look in on Dan kolb next. I want to hear what the grocery store manager thinks about his bagging skills

Obviously

The pressure and rush of the 6:00pm dinner-prep rush are too much for him, so after bursting too many paper bags, and failing to double plastic bag the milk and canned goods, the manager had no choice but to demote him to the less-pressure filled weekday 8:00am shift. Kolb’s reaction was that of silenced anger, and he quietly changed out of uniform into jeans and stormed out of Kroger without a word.

Off-topic

Via Twitter:

G-Braves win 8-3! Freeman 4-for-4, 2HR, 3R, 4RBIs…minus Hicks, all G-Braves in lineup had a hit!

Every G-Brave? Even the pitcher?
Nice job Freeman.

So Frankenstine has hit 3HRs in his last 4ABs after hitting .150 the first few weeks. Love it.

I wonder if CB is at this game in Norfolk…I bet he is..

Yes he was, so was I and justincredible.

It was a day full of awesomeness and epic win

It was nice to meet you today!

It was actually 9-3.

Wish I could find a better pack of stats...

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/split.cgi?n1=acostma01&year=Career&t=p#pitco
Trying to look into Acosta in one inning vs. a second, as I seem to recall Manny getting lit up a lot in his second inning of an appearance. Perhaps he just gives out after that first set (his numbers appear a lot worse after a 25th pitch). Did anyone else get that impression of him, that if he’s going out for a second inning, he’s guaranteed to get rocked? I’d love to see a breakdown of his numbers in 1 inning or less vs. greater than 1 inning.

I have a similar suspicion and I’m a little surprised BR doesn’t have that split. Closest thing they have is pitch count, which appears to support your theory.

MLB seems to have a "first inning" split...

but for the current year only as far as I can tell. Fangraphs, espn, and others don’t seem to have it either. I’d go game by game and test my theory, but like Nick Saban, I don’t have time for that shit.

Javy was such a good fit with the Braves, it’s not even funny.

He really wanted to win with us. And I think that ‘A’ on his hat made all the difference in the world. It’s like it gave him what he needed to dominate. And he fit in so well with teh guys.

I still miss Javy alot.

I am always interested in Furcal

especially after contract-gate

Hey guys how do you do the view from your seat submission? I am going to Saturday AAA game in Durham!

Just send the picture in an e-mail to Gondeee

Peterson Thomas Orr

and maybe Willie Harris.

I heard Pete Orr was in the minors
I heard Pete Orr was in the minors


I actually liked the kid…
I would like to see Kotchamn and maybe FUGA
If anyone needs to feel good about getting rid of a player,

Charlie Morton this year..

I wouldn’t mind still having Morton, although Medlen is a way better version of his probable Brave’s role…

Sometimes you just need a change of scenery to get going. Vazquez is very well known for having a tough time in the AL, but he’ll get the 200 innings that the Yanks want and with their team he may very well be the Derek Lowe of the team(high run support)

Just thought of another one. Charles Thomas

The Little Hurt..

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