Talking Chop

Really?

Wagner was warming up when the Braves were ahead by three (save situation), after they scored that last run to make it a non-save situation, do you really think it would have been a smart move to sit Wagner down and quickly warm someone else up?

Team Effort, really

Let’s do this.

Chief Noc-A-Homa - April 15, 2010 reply

Stat of the night #2

Jason Heyward Ks – 12
Matt Diaz/Melky Cabrera Ks – 11

Jason Heyward BBs – 5
Melky Cabrera BBs – 5

…just sayin’…

justincredubil02 - April 15, 2010 reply

Figured you would have something. :)

you do have to hit the ball on occasion tho, and that’s what Heyward is doing and what McLouth, Melky and Diaz aren’t doing.

Scott Coleman - April 15, 2010 via mobile reply

12Ks while producing a line of .303/.410/.667/1.077 = damn fine job
11ks with a line of sucky/lousy/shitty/pathetic = epicfail

And no, its not that I’m too lazy to add up and average the other outfielder’s stats, I’m just afraid if I do it I’ll get all emo and go all /wrist in the bathtub when I actually see the numbers. sucky/lousy/shitty/pathetic is actually an improvement over what the real numbers would be.

Rhyno18 - April 15, 2010 reply

I’ll take Heyward’s strikeouts as long as he’s producing. He’ll learn to adjust to Major-League pitching eventually. Right now, Diaz and Cabrera aren’t producing.

And Diaz/Cabrera actually have 13 Ks between them.

TonyAlmeyda - April 15, 2010 reply

Stat of the night #3

Melky Cabrera OPS+ -8. That’s right…-8.
Matt Diaz OPS + -8. Again… -8.
Jason Heyward OPS+ 147.

C’mon…quit trying to bring Heyward DOWN to their level. Heyward is in a run producing spot, and he is coming through.

If you can sit here and say you are happy with that production out of the leadoff spot, I’d say you’re lying. The job of a leadoff man is to get on base…Melky and Diaz aren’t getting on base.

It’s own thing if those two are hitting the ball hard and they’re getting unlucky (i.e., Escobar, Glaus), but they aren’t. But all Melky is hitting is little weak ground balls up the middle. So please stop trying to compare Diaz and Cabrera’s K’s and BB’s totals to Heyward. Especially since Heyward has 35 Plate Appearances (coming into the game tonight) and those two have a combined 3,600+ plate appearances.

dunnytwogloves - April 15, 2010 reply

wait

are you trying to compare Heyward to Cabrera, Diaz, and McLouth?

drumzalicious - April 16, 2010 reply

No, just trying to talk some people back from the “Our leadoff hitters suck!” ledge – since it ihas been less than 2 weeks of baseball so far.

Just Venting

Ofcourse…great win…but seriously Bobby Cox is using Saito and Wagner the exact same way he’s used Moylan/Gonzo/Soriano (all sat out almost entire seasons with arm troubles)….in situations where they are not necessarly needed….it drives me absolutely crazy….these guys are veterans and i know they sometimes ‘need to get their work in’…but in 5 months after 60 or 70 appearences….i don’t where our 40 year-old set-up man and 38 year old closer will be….i just don’t get that old f&%ckers thought process sometimes…i.e. didn’t Wags pitch yesterday too with a 5 run lead?? (i know we had the off-day and the blow-out on Monday) But Rockies coming into town tomorrow – they’re always tight games so if we actually NEED Wags tomorrow he’ll definitely be unavailable on Saturday….maybe even unavailable for tomorrow’s game!

Nova Scotia Steve - April 15, 2010 via mobile reply

this is exactly why we have a guy like Jesse Chavez who is more than capable of pitching in these situations

tripl21 - April 15, 2010 reply

Since when has he proven he can pitch in save situations? NSS is right. Bobby’s use of the bullpen is getting epically bad! Wonder how many arms is he going to blowout this year?

FitzFan - April 15, 2010 reply

it wasn’t a save situation—— 4 run lead. if chavez started to break down…. then we could send in wags. but i agree where chavez?

Braves Biceps - April 16, 2010 reply

it’s all 20/20. Just imagine if we let Chavez pitch and he gives up 2 or 3 baserunners by the time Wagner can go in. IF we would lose a game because we were trying to save our pitcher in the middle of freakin April…the players and fans would both go nuts.

better to be safe than sorry.

good point

Braves Biceps - April 16, 2010 reply

Basically, WIN > Stats. I agree.

On the other hand, Win (in April) > Fatigued (i.e. season longevity) IDK.

What a complicated conundrum.

romone_braves91 - April 16, 2010 reply

this

easy man

bobby has done this his whole career. nothing new to see here. if wags or saito break down, then we can yell or scream about the abuse, but lets hope that doesnt happen. good win, and the braves are 1 BS away from winning both series on a tough west coast trip

jman07 - April 16, 2010 reply

Glad to see this game went well...

Considering how the caps – habs game went!

SuperNewb - April 15, 2010 reply

what a disaster that game was…

Sweet

and to top it off we have our best pitcher going for his league leading third win tomorrow!

bpk228480 - April 16, 2010 reply

hahaha

/facepalm

At least we know we’ll score some runs tomorrow.

EricGreggWasPaidOff - April 16, 2010 reply

Prediction:

The Braves’ offense tomorrow is going to make us think they’re playing at Coors instead of The Ted.

A dozen runs, over or under?

hahaha

Amusing, but serious question: Why all the hate for Derek Lowe?

I just started following Talking Chop a few weeks ago, and while I understand why he’s not a fan favorite (overpaid and all that), the guy is, you know, a good pitcher. I almost feel sometimes by some of the comments that you guys would rather have him (and the Braves by that matter) lose rather than have Lowe win with some more run support than the other guys get. A win for Lowe is a win for the Braves.

I think

There is a lot of resentment for the size of his contract – most anyone not named Albert Pujols receives this criticism at some point of their contracts’ lifetime. A-Rod, Beltran, Soriano, WELLS, have all received heaps of criticism, but the fans ease off for a few hours when they contribute to a win. It’s no different with pitchers either; no matter many wins Barry Zito, or Gil Meche notch, fans resent the financial restraint they put on an org, and that there was someone better all along making less money that could’ve been had instead.

Along with the financial aspect, I think a lot of people are just astounded by Lowe, and can’t comprehend his ability to be the winning pitcher despite occasional solid average-to-below mediocrity. He’s kind of a statistical anomaly, sorta. His slider doesn’t slide anymore, the GB/FB ratio is declining, and it just seems like he labors more than any of our other pitchers. Yet he notches the wins due to the offense seemingly capable on his days. Not his fault, naturally, but it doesn’t stop the resentment from materializing out of thin air. And then people recall that for every 6.0IP, 2K, 4BB, 4ER DLW he wins 8-5, there are games in which he’ll have a blister, or a toe problem, and get schellacked for 5 runs in an early inning and tax the bullpen.

I see what you’re saying, but to answer your question, these are the reasons why I think there is resentment towards Lowe. But I’m not complaining when the team wins when he takes the mound.

I think it has more to do

with the other pitchers than Lowe, really. The other guys aren’t paid as much, generally pitch better, and don’t get the run support he does. Lowe is a good pitcher, though. He only looks bad because the rest of our staff is so awesome (please ignore JJ’s last start). People around here just wish that the wins would be apportioned more closely with how well guys pitch. If Vazquez had won 20 and JJ 18 last year, no one would have minded that Lowe won 15, and there’d be a bit less criticism of his contract.

Jacob Peterson - April 16, 2010 reply

Maybe

But I don’t completely buy it. Tim Hudson is going to make $500k more than Derek Lowe this year – and how many games did he start last year?

Veterans get paid more than the young players, even the best. Look at Ryan Howard and how he had to fight to get a fair contract. That’s just baseball. If the reason for all the bitterness is that players like Hanson and Jurrjens are underpaid compared to Lowe, that’s just silly. The run support thing factors in, but why get mad at Lowe about that?! That’s the other 8 guys on the field. Why aren’t people mad at them for not scoring runs when Jurrjens pitches rather than somehow blaming Lowe for that?

It all just kind of boggles my mind. Yeah, Lowe may be overpaid, but he’s a vet who was signed to pitch a ton of games, never get hurt, and ultimately win games. In my opinion, he accomplished that last year, and looks on pace to do the same thing this year.

Edit on the Hudson contract

That was last year. Hudson is slated to make 12 mil this year (3 mil less than Lowe), but that almost improves my point. Hudson was paid more than Lowe last year, and only started 8? games at the very end of the season. Yet fans love him and hate Hudson – so please don’t tell me its about money.

A big part of Hudson's bill last year

Was picked up by the insurance. He made his money, and it didn’t prevent the Braves from going out and signing pitchers to fill his spot anyway.

Bronn - April 16, 2010 reply

WHERE DID THE FYF AND ANDRUW JONES POST GO?

What/?!?!?!? I missed them in the 6 hours I was working!?!?!?!?? They sound like an interesting read.

bpk228480 - April 16, 2010 reply

One post

Talking about how “He can recognize talent,” and basically praising them for one week worth of playing really well, since they were unappreciated.

Bronn - April 16, 2010 reply

and that the Braves were nuts for letting them go and how much Melky, McLouth and Diaz suck after one week.

And that we were all tools or something for not cheering for FYF and that anyone who had a failcoeur shirt was a douchebag.

something like that…

I didn't know that Andruw had hit 3 HRs, though

Good for him. I actually was kind of hoping the Braves would take a shot on Andruw as 4th OFer this offseason, before the White Sox got him. I think he can still play at least average CF defense and above average on the corners, which gives him value even if he struggles with that bat. Looks like the White Sox figured it out, since they’re using Andruw in RF and Quentin as DH, rather than the reverse.

Of course, Andruw got out to a hot start last year as well, and still ended up with a .214/.323/.459 line. Let’s wait a bit longer to see if he can maintain a decent average-batting average actually DOES matter, just not as much as we used to think.

Bronn - April 16, 2010 reply

and

apparently we let Nelson Cruz go at some point, even though he was never with the Atlanta organization. That damn Frank Wren is stupid for letting him go.

JFP - April 16, 2010 reply

Nelson Cruz is a beast, on that subject.

It’s too bad we never actually had him.

Jacob Peterson - April 16, 2010 reply

86'd

I was hoping you would let it stick around for the .gifs alone.

I thought about it

Because they were amusing. But it was like the Nationals trotting out the RF platoon of Willy and Willie; you just really can’t.

hahaha. nice.

i believe i called it in my comment on that post that it would be gone by morning.

Heyward K's

I think Heyward is doing great, he’s been one of the top guys on my fantasy team even (freakin’ Prince Fielder needs to start hitting). Anyway one note on those Heyward K’s. Has anyone else noticed that he swings and misses A LOT on low breaking balls and change ups? Stuff that MAYBE starts at the bottom of the zone and then drops out and often times away? That’s what I’ve been seeing a lot of. Personally I think the only reason Heyward is striking out that much (not that it’s out of control) is that he just hasn’t seen as much filthy stuff in the past as he is now. He’s absolutely hammering mistakes and he’ll get used to the nastier pitches, probably THIS YEAR!!! That’s exciting

foxrobe - April 16, 2010 reply

Too think

That this guy can be THIS good while often looking a little overmatched in certain at-bats is scary. All this while having guys like Melky and Mclouth batting behind him.

I can’t even imagine how good he will be once he starts laying off the junk and making pitchers throw him good pitches, especially once he gets moved into the heart of the order with protection. He will be an absolute nightmare for opposing teams.

ATLandUNC - April 16, 2010 reply

Last night

He also hit an RBI double off one of those exact same pitches. So if he can do that every other time after striking out on those pitchers, I’ll take it.

Didn't like Diaz tonight, but...

McLouth went 1-2 with a walk. Not bad. It’s April…not a huge deal, yet.

Luckily, we have Heyward, Prado, BMac, and that speedster Chipper to pick up the team while Cabrera and McLouth work on their timing. Glaus was solid the other night…Hinske kicks ass off the bench…our bullpen (aside from Jo-Jo) is awesome so far…and staring pitching that always gives you a chance (even Lowe, I suppose)…I like this team.

If the only problem in April is a few cold hitters…I’ll take it.

award6 - April 16, 2010 reply

Yeah, McLouth looked much better tonight. Hit a rocket right at the 2B too.

http://espn.go.com/media/pg2/2002/0724/photo/a_braves_sp.jpg

What year did the braves where these jersies... originally?

BravesFanScout - April 16, 2010 reply

I seem to recall those being from the early 70s back when Hank Aaron and Darrell Evans were playing. I’m pretty sure I’ve seen photos of Hank wearing that uniform.

I don’t like those jerseys they used last night. Brings back too many memories of (mostly) very bad Braves teams from the Murphy-Horner era.

Zontar - April 16, 2010 reply

Yeah, i thought they looked okay. But i really like those jersies in the link.

I think they need to bring those jerseys back from time to time

BravesFanScout - April 16, 2010 reply

1974 was the year they were honoring by wearing those. Braves wore that style quite a few years though.

Rhyno18 - April 16, 2010 reply

Don’t know if it got posted before, but in honor of the jersey’s worn last night: 1984 Braves Vs Pads BRAWL for it ALL!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYZSldEqLWI&feature=player_embedded

Lennox - April 16, 2010 reply

That’s amazing… thanks for reposting. I’d never seen that before.

Cammando2317 - April 16, 2010 reply

Haha wow

That is amazing, never seen that before. I can’t actually imagine a Joe Torre managed team being that out of control, but that was hilarious.

Thanks, funny stuff! As a salesman, my Dad had season tix for the Braves throughout the 80s, so we went to a number of games whenever I came to visit. Unfortunately neither of us has the stubs or programs (I don’t know if I ever had my hands on them), so I don’t know specifically which ones – except the ones I still have souvenir items from (a Rowland Office blue bat, little “a” hat). But I do remember seeing several games with fights. I even remember hoping there would be a fight so there’d be some kind of excitement – it got a little boring with all that losing going on.

Lizziebeth - April 19, 2010 reply

I dont like the way BC is using the bullpen already. I agree with some of the comments that were made earlier about using Wags back-to-back in non saves situations. Why not use Dunn(not sure if he was active) or even Chavez. I understand its April and all but if Chavez comes in and gives up a hit or run pull him out.

i am just worries about how we r using a 38 year old setup and the 50 year old Wags/….Go Braves! Huge series tonight

AlRoBraves95 - April 16, 2010 reply

innings pitched:

Wagner: 5
Saito: 5
Moylan: 5.2
EOF: 3.2
Medlen: 5.1
Chavez: 3.1

Can everyone just shut up about this now? Wags and Saito aren’t even in the top 2 in terms of IPs

So it's too early to bash leadoff hitters...

but not too early to judge Bobby’s use of the bullpen?

It’s too early to bash either one.

And people are complaining that he is overusing Wags and Soriano, when that is just not true.

There you go again, trying to start an argument.

Even as a small boy, they use to say, "That one's gonna be a helluva shit stirrer"

I thought about that, mostly from a looking ahead perspective. We’ve got a big series this weekend, it would be nice to have those guys available for every game if need be, but now that won’t happen. But, it was a close game until the 8th, and Wagner was already warm, so what can you do?

Lowe is pitching, we’re scoring 10+ easy. No need for the bullpen.

Cox knows what’s up.

you are wise

I’m an idiot. Lowe will pitch 7, then Bobby will turn it over to ~~JoJo~~ Dunn, then Chavez. Final score, 14-8 Braves.

Did you not catch the fact that Lowe is pitching? 14 runs?? I think you meant 24.

i forgot. i’ve got alot on my plate right now.

A complete game here would...

shut people up for at least two days about the overpaid Mister Blister.

We could only hope, but I think people would still complain.

It was a good thing Prado turned away to keep from getting teabagged.

bravos1984 - April 16, 2010 reply

I haven’t been able to post this in the threads due to ongoing home laptop trouble, but i just has to!

Get your shit together.

Man, i don’t know whats going on with it. Its so slow loading the page, which in game threads, leads to me being way behind. It seems to get stuck loading that last picture while not showing new comments as they appear, which leads to me reading to the bottom, hitting refresh, and there’s like 50 new comments. Its hard to get in on conversations when you’re 5-10 minutes behind everything.

It's called "Comment Bankruptcy"

Ignore everything except goofy pictures that are directed at Justin or Sanchez, and then start fresh at the bottom of the page after hitting Shift+A

For a recap of a solid win,

this thread sure is negative. Can we all just agree to wait until at least 50-60 games have been played before we decide that Melky, Nate, or Diaz can’t hit? Also, can we please all stop being surprised about Bobby’s bullpen management? Yeah, he overuses guys. We get it.

Anyway. That was a great win last night. Some clutch hitting, some signs of life from Esco (must’ve been the unis), and some solid pitching. I’m sure the guys are glad to be coming home 5-4. Let’s keep it going!

Jacob Peterson - April 16, 2010 reply

Like mamma said – some people, even if you give them a free bowl if ice-cream…it would be the wrong flavor.

NCChopper - April 16, 2010 reply

Told a notoriously sour friend at the bar one night

“I’d give you a million dollars, and you’d bitch cause the bills aren’t crisp.”

lol

Let me try one:

I’d give you a million dollars, and you would try to tell me that I wasn’t actually giving you a million dollars, but rather, a thousand $1,000 bills.

$1,000 bills aren't acceptable currency...

I’m not some bank transacting with the Fed here buddy. $100 only. I might take singles. And thanks for reminding me of the scene from Big with Hanks and the kid cashing his paycheck.

For some reason

I’m reminded of the episode of Full House where Stephanie makes the slot machine pull that wins the jackpot, and everyone thinks it’s Joey’s, until casino security busts them.

She was always the mosst attractive Tanner daughter to me.

Hi. Why don’t you have a seat over there?

Nope, I'm clean...

Jodie Sweetin is less than 18 months younger than me.