The Braves' anemic offense loses anothoer one, as Derek Lowe allows only 2 runs over eight innings and the Atlanta hitters reward him with only 5 singles. Former Brave Jason Marquis picked up his 5th win of the season for the Rockies, also pitching 8 innings, but only allowing 1 run.
As hitters like Kelly Johnson, Jeff Francouer, and Jordan Schafer continue to struggle, the question begs to be asked: when will some major changes be made? The Braves are 13th in the National League in runs scored, as well as being 13th in slugging percentage, coming in at just a .395 clip as a team. The team simply isn't scoring enough to help the pitching, which, despite the troubles of the bullpen in the last two games, has been quite good.
0 recs | 58 comments
The Brave are now 0-2 on the days that I’m doing the Open Thread and Recap. If this continues, I’m going to have to recuse myself.
cbwilk - May 19, 2009
I blame you CB… and Garrett Anderson.
MatM - May 19, 2009
I’m dead serious man. I was very superstitious when I played ball; I can’t be a part of the Braves losing.
cbwilk - May 19, 2009
you messed up the title. its the rockies not the dbacks
longshotsmith - May 19, 2009
Yeah…I’m awesome.
cbwilk - May 19, 2009
I'd like to see Garrett Anderson
Playing somewhere else. Preferably a retirement home. And for Christ’s sake, not batting 4th on our team in front of McCann.
Perrinbar - May 19, 2009
What are the Braves supposed to do?
Its not like they have a ton of options. We have no ML ready hitters in the minors besides the very mediocre BJones and Blanco. Here are a few options:
You said KJ is struggling. He’s already in a platoon. Whats next? Start Infante, who’s been a bench banger for 5 years now at 2nd? Try out Prado maybe?
What can we do about Schafer? Call up Blanco (whos hitting .250 in AAA)? We dont have another CF. I mean right now, it looks like our best backup plan would be to call Gorkys Hernandez up (which WONT happen this early).
What can we do about GA or Frenchy? Sit em on the bench while we throw a mix of Norton/Diaz/BJones/Infante out there? None of those guys, besides Diaz, has played more than 75 games in the OF. Norton is 3/25 this year. Diaz is really, really inconsistent. Bjones either singles or makes an out (that’s all FYF is good for, but he plays better defense so he gets the edge).
From what you guys are saying, you wanna sit Francoeur, GA and Schafer, and replace them with Matt Diaz, Omar Infante and Brandon Jones? No thanks.
Outside of a trade, what can we honestly do to make ourselves better?
If our rotation sucked, we could fix it with all our minor league talent. If our bullpen was absolutely horrible (its decent this year) we could try calling some guys up from AAA. But we dont have shit in our system to help us offensively.
As of right now, we’re kinda stuck.
Scott Coleman - May 19, 2009
Anyone think we are about to see a huge package of our youngsters get traded for a bat?
Medlen, Jo-Jo, BJones, Acosta, and Morton along side with KJ but Frenchy, and GA could go as well.
TomGarrett - May 19, 2009
no trades
This is at best a .500 team. FW ain’t gonna trade away the farm for help this year. Wouldn’t make any logical sense. This team is not a contender. Probably two years away.
Me, personally, I start Infante everyday at 2nd. And I’m curious at what Prado could do in left. (Gotta be better than what we have now)
Can we admit Kawakami was a mistake and call up Hanson, too?
We have no chance, why not use this year like we did in ’89 and ’90?
I hate to give up this early, but lets be honest. And take advantage of what is left to give the youngsters some experience. It paid off before. Might work again.
samxrm - May 19, 2009
I'm not advocating a major trade
and, to the contrary, strongly believe that it would be utter folly to (again) give away an array of rising talent on the farm in exchange for an over-priced, aging, short term rental of a batsman who would (again) soon be gone.
Good trades are very hard to find. Possible maybe, but very hard. Kelly is or could be a moveable piece and could potentially be packaged with Morton or Medlin, but Bobby knows he’s about to get hot and so I’m thinking its very improbable and unlikely. Personally, I think it would be a mistake to let go of Kelly or Medlin unless somebody was giving us an excellent young corner outfielder, which is a serious longshot at best.
So, I still think THE single best, short term option for our obviously urgent need for additional offense (particularly from the right side) is Barbaro Canizares, who continues to put together a damn impressive season in Gwinnett. His numbers after 38 games include 11 doubles, 7 HR, 25 RBI, .324 AVG, .392 OBP, .541SLG, and .932 OPS.
In my capacity as GM pretend, I released 37 year old Greg Norton and called up Canizares several weeks ago.
fandave - May 19, 2009
I’m all for giving Canizares a shot, but it probably should be Norton who is demoted/released. It should be FYF, but we all know that ain’t gonna happen.
Smoltz's Beard - May 19, 2009
Smoltz's Beard - May 19, 2009
I can sum it up for everybody. It's actually very simple: we're fucked.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
KJ’s not really struggling. He worked the count pretty well last night, and hit two seeds right at someone. FYF needs to fuck off though, I’m sick of him and his pathetic ABs.
Smoltz's Beard - May 19, 2009
But guess who’ll get benched?
10-4 - May 19, 2009
Hell, half the people on this blog want him traded. I don’t get it.
Smoltz's Beard - May 19, 2009
sigh
Little Lady - May 19, 2009
This is worth repeating......and worth mentioning....
~ Putting GA between Chip and Mac is like putting out a fire.
~ I’m close to sticking a fork in Frenchy. He’s almost done.
~ The Fates are mocking us because Joe and Boog no longer mention Syndrome.
~ I’m really not worried about Kelly or Casey. They will be ok (hopefully, like, SOON)
~ We are playing like everything is so forced, and it’s such an effort…..other clubs pick up on this, and step on our face while we’re drowning. When you feel overmatched playing the Rockies at home……….I don’t even need to finish that sentence.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
Kotchman “will be OK”? He’s got an OPS near .800. Anyone arguing theres something wrong with him if a buffoon
bigjoe - May 19, 2009
yeah, that was just to cover any casey-haters. No complaints, here.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
I love the way....
…some people on here go from the heights of “this is a great team …. we are definitely contending!” to “this team sucks…we’re going nowhere…trade ’em all!” over literally the course of three games. Seriously, after Friday night’s game, the Braves were the stuff, yahoo, let’s go!…we lose two games since then, and it’s all over. C’mon people, make up your minds. And you know who you are….
sddbaker - May 19, 2009
true.
Not sure who you’re reffering to specifically, but alot of fans do jump on and off the bandwagon. The thing I’m pissed at most, is that we really do have the potential for a 22-15 record right now with the guys we have, but we just…..don’t. It’s either all or nothing so far this year.
It seems to be like alot of our guys aren’t “focused.” Not sure what they are thinking about, but it’s definitely not baseball. When you have a feeling that the game is over in the 3rd inning, that’s never good.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
ahh....
…the irony…..
sddbaker - May 19, 2009
yup…it’s unbelievable
Smoltz's Beard - May 19, 2009
I still have Faith + 1
mvandonsel - May 19, 2009
i have definitely noticed that. Even when I’m not following sports because I’m too busy sometimes, I can log on to TC and look at the fanpost titles to determine if the Braves are hot and cold.
Those back-and-forth fans should start watching the 16-game NFL instead of the 162-game MLB.
angrysmurf - May 19, 2009
Let me fix this for you
royhobbs - May 19, 2009
haha. Lucky me. Football puts me to sleep.
If you’re watching on tv, football is more about car commercials than a sport.
And the fools have instant replays up the ass. MLB can really get under my skin. No umpire is God.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
oh noes
we’re going to finish out the season 18-144!
The worst part about any loss isn’t the fact that I felt like the Braves should’ve won that game easily if not for the fifty Vidros that were hit into, but the overreacting I have to look forward to whenever I log on in the morning.
But whatever, get it all out, vent, whine, bitch, etc. Hopefully the Braves got all their suck out of the way within the last two games, and are ready to actually not make Turner Field feel like such a home field disadvantage.
royhobbs - May 19, 2009
what frustrates me..
is the fact that we are just good enough to not do anything drastic, but not good enough to compete. i have a feeling that we will be seeing the same pattern all year (hovering around .500) until someone in the front office realizes jeff francoeur, ganderson, carlyle, and bennett are not major league players. we have commmitted to schafer and he deserves a year of growing pains. my solution:
1.diaz in left field: permanently
2.infante platoons with schafer (u just can’t send the kid down to the minors)
3.get rid of francoeur, anderson, carlyle, parr, and bennett any way possible
4. get a bat by trading a few of the crap pieces listed above with one of the expendable starting candidates such as morton or reyes.
5. call up medlen, acosta, and b. jones.
6. dont bring in moylan with runners on base!
roster:
infield:
chipper
esco
kj
kotchman
mccann
bench:
norton
ross
b. jones
prado
infante/schafer
outfield:
diaz
schafer/infante
xavier nady, dye or whoever, just as long as it’s not francoeur….
rotation:
lowe
jurrjens
vazquez
kawakami
medlen/glavine/hanson
‘pen:
soriano
gonzalez
moylan
o’flaherty
medlen/reyes
acosta
campillo
the worst thing is that francoeur is the root of all the braves’ problems yet noone in the front office sees it (or wants to deal with it).
ryan c - May 19, 2009
+1 for the last comment
calling up Acosta is a bad call
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
+1 or more
I’m pretty much wishing you were GM right now.
WienerDog - May 19, 2009
Therefore, “get rid of [him] … any way possible.”
Maybe just release him and then hand him a one way ticket to Outer Mongolia! Would that make you happy?
You people just don’t get it. Whether he gets on track or not, as I said yesterday:
fandave - May 19, 2009
It's like a swinging door with the guy....
He temporarily found “it,” and just as quickly as he found “it”…….he fucking lost it. While Omar could be playing right and cleaning up at the plate. Loves it.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
I agree, especially about Frenchy.
Fortune favors the brave(s) - May 19, 2009
This is a .500 team despite a pathetic outfield. Give this team a couple of better bats in the outfield and why couldn’t they make the playoffs? There are veteran free agents like Edmonds and Gonzalez available for peanuts who would be better than the players we are running out there now. Brandon Jones may not be a future HOFer but he can at least post an OBP over .300. The Braves have so much minor league talent that they could surely trade a little of it to upgrade their offense without damaging the future. Wren didn’t spend all the money upgrading the pitching staff this offseason just to sit idly by and watch the offense ruin the season. He surely will act at some point. I just hope it isn’t too late by then.
redwards95 - May 19, 2009
The part about it that cracks me up (and only the Braves could/would do this)..........
Doing ok against Thillies
Doing ok against Mutts
Doing ok against Nats
Doing….ok against the Marlins
It “falls apart” against the Dbacks and the Rockies. Any team playing like this is just going to fuck themselves. We really don’t need anybody else to do it for us.
“Hopefully tonite we can turn it around.”
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
why?
what part of 76 innings pitched in the majors of 3.17 ball, and a good track record in the minors firightens you? since converted to the pen in the minors, manny has been great. he is far better than bennett or carlyle, and has a track record to prove it.
ryan c - May 19, 2009
But he goes from Jekyll to Hyde when he gets called up
Our bullpen has had a few bad outings, but pitching is the last of my concerns right now….
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
You people really think that FYF, Carlyle, JoJo, etc are going to net a quality OF? More than likely we’ll have to part with some prospects that actually amount to something. And then what? We trade these people for someone like Carlos Lee or Magglio Ordonez (ignoring the fact that we can’t afford them)…and then we don’t make the playoffs and the very same people who advocated the trade in the first place are back here bitching about it.
Can’t wait.
Smoltz's Beard - May 19, 2009
I like to think of that scenario as "Tex: Part Deux"
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
I didn’t have a problem with the Tex trade at the time, and I still don’t have a problem with it now. But to do the EXACT SAME THING again, for inferior hitters…that would be a disaster.
Smoltz's Beard - May 19, 2009
nothing of "long-term" value...
if anyone thinks that jo-jo reyes or charlie morton has a future in a braves uniform, then i will respectfully disagree. my original post said nothing to the argument of trading carlyle, bennett, and others for a bat, but rather to piece them with francoeur and jojo/morton for a bat. and the term “quality” doesnt mean “elite”.
xavier nady>francoeur, morton, and carlyle.
and dave, i do get it. he sucks and has since ‘06. he would not be on another major league roster with his production the past 2 years, and it’s 100% bobby’s fault for running him out there day after day, while showing little, to no, patience with people such as manny acosta, joey devine, and kyle davies. what is your argument based on? his defense? if francoeur gets on base at a sub .300 clip again, putting mccann in right field with ross catching would be an upgrade. btw, francoeur’s defense…not that great.
jo-jo reyes, or charlie morton, with any of those other players are not even comparable to the group we gave texas and everyone on this board should know that….
ryan c - May 19, 2009
The Xavier Nady who has intense elbow issues? That one?
bigjoe - May 19, 2009
Please use the reply button…it’s not that difficult.
Nady’s injured so I’m assuming that you’re using him as merely an example, but I guess my question is…how much do you expect a bat like Nady to help us out? If we can piece together a trade involving FYF, Morton, Carlyle and get an upgrade RF…sure, I’m all for it. But you know some of the names that are thrown around here…Ordonez, Lee, Dye, McLouth…that package isn’t going to cut out. We’d have to package together prospects with decent upside for a shot at landing those guys.
Is it worth it? Who knows, I just find it laughable that everyone on here is up in arms about the situation. Most of the people who were bitching about the organization’s lack of forward thinking during the Tex trade, are the very same people who want us to do it all over again!
Smoltz's Beard - May 19, 2009
Francoeur won a gold glove in 2007, so the real evaluators of ML talent would seemingly differ from you with regard to assessing his defensive capacities.
And I get it that you have decided he obviously and totally sucks.
I also get it that you (and all the other FYF SUCKS crowd) are not the manager or general manager of the Atlanta Braves, and that they pretty obviously intend run him out there every single day and give him every possible opportunity to overcome his struggles and grow into a solid middle of the order power batsman.
In 2007, in what was according to you a massive suck season, he had 40 doubles,19 HR, 105 RBI, and significantly higher OBP and OPS than he had had in 2006, when (according to you) he didn’t suck.
I agree he had a truly lousy 2008 and he has not given us much production so far this season, although he has looked better than he looked most of last season.
But my basic point is he is a natural multi-tool talent, is a young player who came out of the gate with 2 and one half pretty impressive seasons, and there is every reason to expect he is going to stay in the lineup indefinitely, like it or not.
fandave - May 19, 2009
Gold Gloves are meaningless and Francoeur was the worst everyday player in all of baseball last year. And he’s well on his way so far this year. Contending treams can’ t afford that from a corner outfielder, especially when the rest of the team is struggling offensively.
TradeAndruw - May 19, 2009
The thing that surprises me the most....
is it looked like he gained back his composure. He looked pretty solid throughout April, then…….yeah. Same old shit, different day.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
If you’re trying to equate winning a GG to actually being a legitimate defender, you can take that talk elsewhere. Everyone should know by now that those things are a joke, as most end of the year awards are in the MLB.
With that being said, most metrics agree that FYF was a well above average outfielder in 2007 but since then has been below average. And even if a GG was an accurate measure to his adventures in RF, it doesn’t mean that years later he’ll still have the same defensive prowess. Players get worse, some quicker/earlier than others. It certainly is interesting, however, that only a couple years later he appears to have forgotten how to play OF. It shows in the numbers, and you should be able to see it with your peepers as well.
Most people on here would be thrilled if he could reproduce his 2007 season, myself included, but there’s just not a whole lot to point to that it’ll ever happen again. His already pathetic BB% is down even further this season, he initially cut back on his strikeouts this year but that number has been steadily climbing in the past few games, and his ISO has declined every year he’s been in the league…it’s now sitting at .116 which just doesn’t cut it for a corner outfielder who lacks the ability to get on base consistently.
Smoltz's Beard - May 19, 2009
This is very true, however. I was surprised when Bobby sat him in favor of Diaz (or Anderson really), but as I expected that certainly didn’t last long. How much further does he have to sink before the FO eats the shit sandwich and moves on?
Smoltz's Beard - May 19, 2009
.....the world....may never know.
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
thanks....
for the motherly advice, but my work computer will not allow me to reply with “reply” (security measures). doesnt make sense i know.
the reason my solution would help is it gets francoeur and garrett anderson out of the lineup. and yes, it would help bucketloads….check the lineups (using “nady” as example):
vs. left
infante (cf)
escobar
chipper
nady
mccann
diaz
kj
kotchman
vs. right
kj
escobar
chipper
mccann
nady
kotchman
diaz
schafer
ryan c - May 19, 2009
I’m speechless. How does simply typing out a lineup suffice for any sort of evidence as to how much the upgrade will help us?
I give up.
Smoltz's Beard - May 19, 2009
lol. sorry. don't mind me
“thanks for the motherly advice…..” lmao. That really made me laugh out loud, but I can relate. Alot of times my work computer won’t let me reply to specific posts either.
Again, my apologies…..continue…
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
ok, since you're being thick...
nady vs francoeur…. any argument?
ganderson vs. diaz….any argument?
lhp: schafer vs. infante…any argument?
what’s your deal? if those lineups arent better than the lineups we currently run out there, i will eat my hat.
if you still think evidence is needed, do the damn research yourself…
i would suggest looking at baseball reference.
i’m speechless….but not yet typeless…
ryan c - May 19, 2009
What’s the argument here? I’ll take a Nady type, I think he’s coming back soon. I’d like to take a shot at Mark DeRosa. I don’t see how we can afford any top-tier offense without mortgaging the farm. I’d also like to see Prado getting more playing time.
Ganderson/Diaz and Schafer/Infante make decent platoons. The problem is RF. Everyone else will come around, and the problem with the bullpen is the way it’s used, not with the talent.
TradeAndruw - May 19, 2009
Adjustments
FYF has trouble making adjustments…his new stance helped him in April until the other team’s scouts ran the numbers and their pitchers found the right combo to make him chase the outside curveball again….from my armchair I think he needs to wait back a little and take a few pitches earlier in the game and then be more aggressive in later
ABs. Or send him back to Miss. It seems he has “Laroach” disease..not thinking about pitchers before he gets up there. GA seems to be playing hurt…maybe a three platoon needs to be used in left (and diaz gets only the lefties). As for Schafer time to platoon…next DL opening bring up Blanco…put him in lead off so he can get the BB and Kelly J can bat second which he has had success at….escobar slides to six..fill in the mid gaps with Chipper, Mcann and ????Prado (he did hit a homerun that won us a game last week)
bravestatoo - May 19, 2009
sounds good to me
Chief Noc-A-Homa - May 19, 2009
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