Really? I guess this means we won't be seeing Yunel Escobar in a Braves uniform next season:
In a stunning turnaround, the free-agent shortstop has chosen the Braves over the A's, according to a major-league source.
A contract agreement is expected to be announced Tuesday, conditional on Furcal passing a physical.
Furcal would play shortstop or second base for the Braves, depending upon which other moves the team makes.
This is going to lead to a whole bunch of other rumors, since the most available and hottest hitting and fielding commodity on the trade market is now Escobar. It will be interesting to see if we matched or surpassed the $40 million four-year deal that the A's offered.
Upon first blush, although this has been somewhat rumored for a while, this is a good move. It allows us to trade Escobar for a pitcher that we obviously couldn't sign as a free agent. It gives us a bonafide leadoff hitter, and doesn't take away anything defensively at shortstop. This may not have been the best move a month ago, but circumstances have changed, and this move now seems like a very good option.
Remember too, that we haven't made the postseason since Furcal left the Braves.
0 recs | 69 comments
Who knows, maybe Wren is thinking about putting Kelly back in left field?
But if it came down to that, I think he would have more value as a trading chip rather than a left fielder. And a TON of teams will have a hard on for Escobar. Its a curious move to be sure, but I want to see the dollar figure before I pass judgement. I like the 4th year option though (as opposed to being guaranteed).
soup du jour - December 16, 2008
Not good
This is not good at all if it involves trading Escobar for Peavy or Greinke. I’ll hold my judgment there until we know who the “pitcher” is that we are targeting.
This eats up a significant chunk of our budget and doesn’t address any need!
scstrato - December 16, 2008
Anyone catch the peavy article? stating what he does away from petco. Basically said hes a number 3 guy on the road.
I hope we go after a young guy: Greinke, Malholm, Cain/Sanchez.
Also, heres to hoping we trade KJ instead of Yunel. I dont know if I can stomach watching him strike out looking 50 times this year.
DrewPhillips07 - December 16, 2008
Ugh
Like it or not, I think this trade almost certainly means that Escobar is gone. And again, in my opinion, like for Peavy. VictorW is about to blow a gasket.
The other alternative is to move Escobar off short. Obviously, he’s not going to third since Chipper is entrenched there. So there’s the outside chance he moves to second, and we trade Kelly. In that scenario, there’s an outside chance they move Kelly to left. That immediately downgrades our defense at 2 positions (SS and LF) while marginally increasing our defense at 1 (2B, which is debatable since Escobar has rarely played there). Furthermore, Chipper, Escobar and Furcal are all injury risks, meaning none are likely to go for 162 (which is ok, since we still have the versatile Infante and the all contact Prado). Bigjoe is right; the Braves should’ve just signed Dunn to the same contract and avoided all this mess. Stick the dude in left; leave Escobar and Kelly as is; and develop your own freaking pitching.
jc25 - December 16, 2008
I don’t see why we can’t play Furcal at 2nd.
soup du jour - December 16, 2008
That they could
But I imagine it’s a reverse A-Rod/Jeter conundrum. Furcal was “entrenched” as the Braves SS for so many years, he’s the veteran, etc., etc. But I imagine the numbers calculate more value with Escobar at short and Furcal at second than vice versa.
jc25 - December 16, 2008
Well, I guess it could be a stipulation in the contract or something. And we all know about how Bobby likes to let the veterans get what they want to a fault. But things are so up in the air right now that its really anyone’s guess. Hell, we haven’t even inked Furcal yet.
soup du jour - December 16, 2008
If I remember correctly, KJ was a pretty damn good outfielder. I know that the worry is that his arm won’t hold up out there because of his TJ surgery, but I wouldn’t mind seeing Furcal at second and Escobar at short with Kelly in LF.
KC Ryan - December 16, 2008
Kelly doesn’t have the bat to play a corner outfield position.
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
Maybe not, but FW used the OF money on a SS…a position that was already being adequately filled.
buzzdeadwax - December 17, 2008
This is a Scheurholtz type move. You don’t hear anything about it, and it happens. Hopefully this is followed by another surprise move. To me, its funner this way. I’m gonna reserve judgement on this until i see who we trade Escobar for.
10-4 - December 16, 2008
not done...
I agree with 10-4. This surprise move has got to be only Part 1 of at least a 2 part series. It should be interesting to see Part 2.
I’ve always liked Furcal; he was one of my favorite Braves when he was with us before and I was sad to see him go.
I’d like to see the trade piece be KJ instead of Yunel and the return be Greinke or Peavy. Peave is more than a #3 pitcher away from PetCo, don’t worry.
RonGantFan - December 16, 2008
Oooh, this would be nice…
VegasAces - December 16, 2008
Not necessarily Yunel
Furcal has been playing second base in Winter Ball. This move does not mean that Yunel is gone, KJ could be the available middle infielder on the trade market. Either way, I think one of the two of them goes for a stud pitcher.
dmack - December 16, 2008
From DOB
Sandy Alderson told Krasovic today, just a couple hours ago in fact, that they’re intending to have Peavy on opening day, and that if they were to trade him now then talks would have to be initiated by the other team, blah blah blah.
That doesn’t mean much, of course. But if the Braves haven’t been talking to them in the past few days, as he indicates, then I’ve gotta believe they’re aiming for another pitcher other than Peavy in whatever trade they’d pull off after signing Furcal.
When Frank said on Thursday that the framework for a couple of deals was in place, just that the other team needed to add or move a player in one instance, and the Braves might have to make a move in another instance, then this was probably one of the deals he was talking about — that they’d have to add Furcal before they could trade Yunel or Kelly for a pitcher.
gopherbroke - December 16, 2008
No FA Compensation
Another reason to like this deal is that Furcal isn’t a Type A or Type B free agent, so the Braves don’t need to provide any compensation to sign him.
Is there any analysis out there regarding the monetary value of draft picks? If the value of draft picks is high, it seems like the FA compensation system rewards teams for signing players like Furcal who played at a Type A or Type B level but whose injuries prevented them from accumulating the stats to require compensatory picks. By extension, the system should allow Furcal to seek a more lucrative contract since the acquiring team isn’t paying draft picks on top of the player’s compensation.
Choke Like Duke - December 16, 2008
Who Goes? Yunel or KJ? Or both...
Nice sign getting Furcal. My gut-call is Yunel gets traded as part of a deal for Peavy or Grienke. Probably Grienke.
Maybe we also trade Kelly for Ludwick or Ankiels? I know Bobby mentioned he wouldnt trade both?
jbird29 - December 16, 2008
If Yunel is still the centerpiece of a trade to San Diego for Peavy, then I’d say Towers won the staring contest. If KJ is the centerpiece in the same trade, then Wren wins.
But I think we may be seeing another pitcher in a Braves uni instead of Peavy (as much as I covet him). Greinke? possibly. That would be great.
But what if it’s another totally stealth move? Who might it be?
RonGantFan - December 16, 2008
I think it’s got to be Yunel for Greinke. We’ve now spent approx 11m on Vasquez and around 10m on Furcal (assuming this deal gets done). Adding Greinke would mean we’ve gotten the two SPs Wren said we wanted, but we’re still short an OF bat.
If it’s Yunel for Peavy we’d take on Peavy’s salary as well, and most of our available funds would be spent. Greinke is significantly cheaper (for now), allowing us the flexibility to go fill that remaining need.
matches - December 16, 2008
If we sign Furcal, trade Yunel for Greinke, and then sign Adam Dunn…that’s pretty much the only way I’m going to be happy…
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
I think you would settle for Burrell too.
Charmin519 - December 16, 2008
No he wouldn’t. Trust me.
royhobbs - December 16, 2008
If you’re trying to bait me…it’s working.
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
No I'm not and your not going to like this either. Check out my fanpost I just did.
KJ and Matt Diaz are LF bound.
Charmin519 - December 16, 2008
I made you something
To keep you calm when the anger rises:
royhobbs - December 16, 2008
Haha…you’re too much…
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
Didn't you see that picture of him lifting weights?
I’ll give you a moment to think about it and reconsider…
buzzdeadwax - December 17, 2008
Disturbing pic, to say the least.
Smoltz's Beard - December 17, 2008
It was kind of gross - unless that's your thing
And to see a professional athlete posing like that was weird.
buzzdeadwax - December 17, 2008
Just say No.
No Burrell please. Dunn is borderline definitely no.
I like the idea of getting Gullien as part of a Grienke deal. Guillens salary is alot lower to. If the Furcal trade happens I can see a Grienke/Gullien deal happening…
jbird29 - December 16, 2008
You’re against Burrell and Dunn, but you’re okay with Guillen? He doesn’t get on base anywhere near as frequent as the other two, and he hits for far less power. He’s also signed for $12 million the next three years.
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
Yep
Salary aside, Gullien has the upside. Kinda like the Javier Vasquez deal. Both were unhappy with there situation. Gullien could shine if he’s happy. Plus he’s a right-handed bat familiar with batting 4th.
jbird29 - December 16, 2008
No…Guillen does not have the upside. He’s older than Dunn and he’s already entered into his decline phase. Dunn is still in the middle of his prime, and if we were to sign him we’d have him in his prime for another two years. Guillen’s also coming off a season in which he took a free pass in just barely 4% on his PAs…Dunn took one in like 20%.
Making an out is pretty much the worst thing a hitter can do, and Guillen does it way more than Dunn.
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
Well...
From what have been reading Dunn is not on the Brave radar. Kinda like Sheets isnt. For some reason Dunn is viewed as a no-sign.
Another factor to look at is Gullien fielding and arm.
jbird29 - December 16, 2008
I know that the Braves aren’t looking at Dunn, but that doesn’t mean they are right in doing so.
I did look at Guillen’s fielding, and it’s really bad.
10 in both LF and RF last season based on +/. Adam Dunn was rated at -12 and -11 on the same scale, so it’s not a big difference in favor of Guillen.Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
Hmm…not sure why that text is struck out…didn’t mean to do that.
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
Yunel
I remember something about additude issues with Escobar. Cox wasnt to pleased with him early-on last year. Prior to that Yunel wouldnt move to 2b in the minors to advance his career. Me thinks the Braves trade Yunel with future issues oblivated.
jbird29 - December 16, 2008
Yes….Yunel was supposedly scared to turn a double play from the 2nd base position having the runner sliding into him.
secondbass - December 16, 2008
It's a matter of comfort
royhobbs - December 16, 2008
Oh…..my!
secondbass - December 16, 2008
Didn’t see that one coming.
Sparhawk - December 16, 2008
Now ESPN...
…is stating that we havn’t reached the agreement yet.
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
I think it's easy to assume that we just took our available budget down to 19-23 million
With that said it’s almost certain that we have the framework for a young inexpensive pitcher in place.
Another Point: I think with the addition of Furcal Wren is trying to get some leadership in the clubhouse for the youth. Chipper, Furcal, Smoltz, will talk about the good days and teach the playoff mentality that is needed. Vazquez is a veteran but hasn’t really won anything. Smoltz is getting so old guys like Reyes and others could write them off as the grandparents that always have a story but are hard to relate too.
I like the move if another follows.
I like the move less if we keep KJ and Escobar and Platoon Diaz and KJ in left. I like the idea that when furcal sits down for a rest we shift KJ back to 2B and put schafer at the lead off spot. I like when Chipper sits down furcal can be shifted to 3B and KJ can go to 2B. It brings a versatility. However, that means were going to settle for the likes of Garland, Japanese senior Citizen, Wolf, etc……
Is Wren thinking about trade deadline next summer? Is he just stocking talent to have bargaining power next year? Think about this Oswalt, Peavy, and Greinke could all be up for grabs by the deadline this year. It’s actually very likely. So even if he doesn’t do anything now is he betting that he can get them later?
Classic Braves style. Bam!!!!!!!! I posted this last night.
<Something Big is going to happen before Christmas next week. No sources, no quotes, no links. Just intuition. It feels like the calm before the storm.>
Charmin519 - December 16, 2008
Damn I tried the block quote thing again and it didn't work. I suck.
Charmin519 - December 16, 2008
Just highlight your text in the comment field and hit the quote button.
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
Charmin519 - December 16, 2008
+1
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
Please tell me Grienke is on his way to Atlanta and not Paul Maholm. I’m scared because we deal with Pitt so much and seemingly have a good relationship with their front office. Yunel is 10 times as valuable as any of their starting pitchers. If Grienke is on the way, I would be ecstatic depending on the package we are sending.
garriscp - December 16, 2008
It's a done deal
coldriver10 - December 16, 2008
A (dumb) question
Is there any chance Furcal goes to 3rd and Chipper moves back to LF?
coldriver10 - December 16, 2008
I would say about a 99.99999 chance that that would Not Happen
jbird29 - December 16, 2008
Did you mean 100% chance that doesn't happen. Good, that's what thought.
Charmin519 - December 16, 2008
I think that LF is worse on Chipper’s legs than 3B. Don’t think that’s going to happen.
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
ah ok, I thought I had heard when he was hurt that 3B was harder on his body and I didn’t understand why that would be the case. I probably just heard wrong.
coldriver10 - December 16, 2008
I thought his move to LF was more to facilitate Vinny Castilla, but who knows…I could be wrong as well.
Smoltz's Beard - December 16, 2008
Please…don’t bring that up. Its a sore subject.
Facilitate Vinny Castilla…holy Pujols what were we thinking.
soup du jour - December 16, 2008
Was it Castilla? I thought he moved to LF for The Big Cat.
coldriver10 - December 16, 2008
It was Castilla
There was a discussion a while back about how Castilla was a failure everywhere in his career but Colorado, where he was always 25+HR, 100RBI guy there.
royhobbs - December 16, 2008
What the hell?
BraveBronco0121 - December 16, 2008
This move imo
Is more of an indication that Kelly will be traded instead of Yunel. I’m not saying Kelly isn’t a good player and would not be missed, but Yunel without question has the higher ceiling. Also, could you imagine the Braves range Yunel and Furcal would cover up the middle? OMFG
ChipperTeixeira89 - December 16, 2008
The fact that Yunel has a higer ceiling indicates that he is more likely to be traded I would say. If the braves are trying to add an Ace who has more value in trade? Yunel and that is why his name, not Kelly’s has been thrown about in rumored trades for Peavy and Greinke etc.
gopherbroke - December 16, 2008
maybe escobar
really rubbed someone on the coaching staff/front office the wrong way? or maybe they know something we don’t about his skill set? because other than that, i don’t see the rush to trade a potential franchise up the middle guy for years to come. and i don’t think the braves would pay that much for furcal to not play the premium posiition he excels at.
son.of.sourman - December 16, 2008
I agree Yunel has to be the guy in one of these trade outlines that Wren was talking about. No reason to pay Furcal so much to play 2B
gopherbroke - December 16, 2008
I agree
Not only are they paying him too much money but he has way to good of an arm to sit at 2B.
Charmin519 - December 16, 2008
Not to pick on you
but Escobar has pretty much the same cannon. Wouldn’t it also be wasted at 2B? I know, I know … he’s likely to be traded …
scstrato - December 16, 2008
If the idea is to sign a 2B
They would have tried to sign Orlando Hudson – although his OPS is only about 30 points higher than KJ at $6 – $8 million extra per season.
buzzdeadwax - December 17, 2008
You think his improved D makes up the extra cash?
Smoltz's Beard - December 17, 2008
You might be right about that
But I don’t have the ability or the inclination to do the actual number crunching. I nominate Victor or 17843 for that job.
buzzdeadwax - December 17, 2008
his defensive numbers have actually decreased over the past 2 years…no idea about all those SEXY numbers certain people use, but RF & ZR and the standard metrics all look worse
bigjoe - December 17, 2008
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